So GGG, how's that improved player retention coming along?

24h peak: 36k players. Thats all what you need to know about player retention. League is fail and it seems obvious to me. And some ppl say devs should not do flashback event because it will hurt player retention. You cant do harm to whats already dead.

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Ury401 написал:

Why would you assume everyone is leaving because of the changes to delve?

The game is MASSIVE for new players, it's really hard to maintain new players that reach a certain level of progression and then get stuck, dropping off the league.

I see so many experienced players saying tons of things, forgetting that they're probably the minority, the game is full of casuals like me. Most of us have to verify the item and look it up in poe trade, while you have people that can tell you the name of the item by just looking at the model.

This is the first league i dedicate a few houndred hours and enjoy, the last league i played i reached lvl 82 and felt like an accomplishment, whilst i see people reaching that lvl in less than 2 days (in hour terms, probably less than 1 day)

So yeah, don't expect every single player to stay on the game, and remember most of us don't even know about this Leagues you all talk about and compare. It's just a complicated game that people will try out at the beginning and then drop when you see you should follow a guide for your first build, that you have so many websites and things you gotta have and verify in order to progress (Poe Ninja, Currency, Vorici calculator, Poe trade, download PoB and learn how it works, download loot filter and understand it's different levels).

Really, exp'd players do this automatically, but all this is probably A LOT to add to the already complex game, or the surprise you get when you see the Passive skill tree and how big it is.

And i didn't even mention how many builds you can make, boss killer or fast mapping, differents way of farming currency and items, and really i can keep going on why this players that leave are NOT leaving because of DELVE or anything else, but just because this beautiful game is huge and not everyone can bear with it.

This !!!
Clusterfuck of stupid shit that not even explained and a new player has no way of knowing.
Also game runs like shit on low end machines so there goes half of ur potential new playerbase

players drop cus this league is trully ... boring.
maps - 1-3/map clink on sulphite
delve - 90% of locations - run with cart and kill spawning monsters
too easy to raise high lvl (xp in delv should be 50-80% lower)
for 90% players 36challanges are IMPOSIBLE to get (boss spawn 1/10000000delves, after about 10days gametime i havent EVEN 1 ***** delve encounter IV)
I didnt drop this league just becouse there are no interesting new games till 02/19. Hope they dont add delve to the core. its kill grinding and market

This troll thread still going?

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Xavderion написал:

This troll thread still going?

Is PoE's retention still shit?

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Morkonan написал:

The problem is that in PoE, the player that works the trade system and puts in the time and effort to master it can, in effect, "buy the win over The Thing." The have doubled the returns of their efforts by being able to purchase items that enable builds that wtfroflstomp the end-game content, if they choose. Players who do not do this but prefer, instead, to "play The Game in order to achieve The Thing" get understandably upset about this.

What's the solution?

Well, one solution is very easy, but it's like hitting the problem with a hammer: Bind on Equip gear. You can't get "The Gear" or "The Key" to achieve "The Thing" unless you actually do "The Stuff" that everyone, no matter how rich they are, must do in order to eventually be able to do "The Thing."

Or, you know, GGG could make the bossfights actually fun to play, so that people are motivated to do it just for fun, not only for the loot. But that would also require removing the egregious RNG gating, and we all know that's never gonna happen.

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suszterpatt написал:

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Xavderion написал:

This troll thread still going?

Is PoE's retention still shit?

Posting a cherry picked 2 whole graphs... I can do that and make Delve look like the best leage they ever did from a retention standpoint. All I need is either Incursion's graph or Breaches (yes I said Breach had worse retention, because thats what the numbers show) So lets drop the deliberate distorted cherry picking and get into some real numbers.

Weekend peak to peak 1 month population loss since breach league (using the Steam charts which will be a representative sample of the whole):

Delve 75k to 45k = ~40%
Incur 95k to 42k = ~55%
Beast 81k to 45k = ~44%
Abyss 70k to 51k = ~27%
Harby 98k to 60k = ~38%
Breac 65k to 34k = ~47%

So what interesting things can we gleen from this? Well for one if Reddit squees all over the new league its probably going to have shit retention. Breach and Incursion are the worse performing leagues in this data set but also seemingly had the most week 1 love letters. On the other hand soundly disliked leagues like Bestiary didn't do that poorly, and mixed reception leagues "well its better than X league at least" seem to have the best. Abyss might have something odd going on (maybe returned players late in the league when they upped the Lich spawn rate? maybe Steam charts culled too many data points during the first week? hard to say) anyway it got mixed reviews but scarcity of Liches and "in your face" extra packs of mobs in every map seem to have kept people playing. Harby's easy mapping and being many peoples first real hope of ever hitting 100 might account for it's 2nd place finish, and Delve has obvious replay value out the wazoo hampered by a really shit Sulphite mechanic. I dare say the Sulphite mechanic (standard-like mapping experience) itself might be the difference between Delve being the top performer or not. One thing is completely reasonable to say: The OP's sky is falling only in his own basement.

Another tangent: Leagues that show you everything in 11 maps cough/Incursion and have uninteresting boss fights with 99% shit loot drops and same-samey tilesets have terrible retention.

Mostly though it seems Delve is #3 in player retention over the first month, I would say the Sulphite mechanic which a lot of people outright hate has a lot to do with this but thats my admitted bias because I think Sulphite is a paper thin chore that is not up to GGG's normal standards for league engagement/resource chore mechanics. I LOVE Delving and if they don't make this an alternate Endgame to boring old mapping I might have to take a long break until they come to their senses.

Also addressing the implication that POE is having a hard time keeping players, while I was actually ACTUALLY (insert nerd voice ACHTHUALLY) looking at the steam chart league numbers I plotted a line from all the leagues average lowest late league population points and called it the "retention floor" if you look at this plot line, POE's worst case scenario is that it has grown its long term player base late in leagues from an average of 6.8k players to an average of 42k players pre Incursion league. Incursion league is discounted because its the sole "outlier" on the entire 5 year history of the game with ~12k retention. We all know Incursion dropped the player retention ball in a big way. It was too short to see all content and too repetitive and samey.

Also it seems reasonable to conclude the WoW expac clearly took a chunk out of the total players, but that can be seen across the entire month of the league.

Bottom line, map rng is garbage.

Who wants to no-life every league to play gated mechanics?

Based on the patch notes and decision on mechanics I'd say they're quite happy with their player retention. Too bad they set their sights so low.

Slightly off topic:
"Or, you know, GGG could make the bossfights actually fun to play, so that people are motivated to do it just for fun, not only for the loot."
Last time I checked, boss fights are about loot, fun is secondary.
I don't mind a tough/annoying/phased fight if the loot is worth it.