Could someone from GGG answer please? :D

Two new permanent leagues will exist within one month from today.

Edit: I should clarify - by permanent I meant "four months".

I just edited my post to clarify that the new leagues have a duration of four months. Information will certainly be posted as soon as we're ready to commit to it.

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HopTortoise написал:

I thought they said they were modeling this shit after Magic: The Gathering?

What a blatant lie.

You never saw WotC changing the god damn rules once an edition of cards was out.

They didn't change the "drop rate" of cards. They didn't evvveerrr change that until the absolute NEXT batch came. that was their opportunity to alter their drop rates, alter the cards, and alter the rules.

Wizards of the Coast actually has made rules changes that retroactively affect old Magic cards. Multiple times.

-When 6th Edition came out, Artifacts stopped "turning off" when they were tapped, and Interrupt spells were all changed to Instants (making them counterable and able to be responded to).

-The rules regarding Phasing have changed multiple times, in turn enabling and destroying various combo decks.

-2 Years ago, the rules for how damage is assigned in combat were changed, removing a layer of complexity from the game and drastically nerfing every instant-speed bounce spell ever, as well as many utility creatures like Mogg Fanatic.

-Individual cards have been errata'd and re-errata'ed to have different functionality, meaning that some old cards don't even do what they say they do on the physical card.

Just FYI.

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Rhys написал:

-2 Years ago, the rules for how damage is assigned in combat were changed, removing a layer of complexity from the game and drastically nerfing every instant-speed bounce spell ever, as well as many utility creatures like Mogg Fanatic.

Fun fact - the rules for damage assigning in combat were initially changed in the aforementioned 6th edition rules overhaul, making creatures like Mogg Fanatic, and instant bounce, etc much better than they had been. The more recent changes moved things back to much closer to what they were in the early game, and actually returned Mogg Fanatic to the functionality he'd been printed with. People complained a lot both times.

The biggest one is probably 6th ed. changing tapped artifacts so they didn't cease to function, because that functionality was retroactively added to a few popular artifacts by specifically changing their wording - compare the 5th edition Howling Mine with the 6th edition version.

Most artifacts changed functionality because the rules changed, but a few instead change what was printed on them, making older printings no longer accurately reflect what the card did, making things inconsistent and confusing for players at the time.

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Rhys написал:

-The rules regarding Phasing have changed multiple times, in turn enabling and destroying various combo decks.

Still mildly upset by this.

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HopTortoise написал:

All of those changes you mentioned happened along with editions and entire rule-set proceedings. So to speak.

They didn't happen in the middle of an event where people are getting points and participating in tournaments and getting rewards.

I admit I had some trouble properly interpreting that first post...

Y'know, the Magic: the Gathering release schedule actually shares some interesting similarities with ours:

-Every 3-4 months, a new edition of cards is released. This is a regular content "patch" to the overall game, similar to our weekly(ish) patches.

-They have short-term events such as Prereleases and individual tournaments, Grand Prix, PTQ, etc. similar to how we have 1-3 hour races.

-They have have long-term events, too: the Pro Tour. Professional Magic players accumulate season points by competing in as many high-level events as they can to earn points over the course of a year. This is very similar to our race seasons.

But WotC does release new Magic expansions (and sometimes rule changes) during the Pro Tour. Pro Magic players have to be able to handle their deck getting nerfed if a card gets banned from Standard, to adapt when powerful new cards enter the current pool. With each new expansion, some decks get buffed, some get nerfed, and often entirely new decks with new strategies will emerge. Sometimes, existing decks will become completely useless in the professional arena.

Sound familiar?

The best deck from 10 years ago (or even 1 year ago!) isn't the best deck now. And the same is true for character builds in Path of Exile. Behold the meta-game: the game that surrounds the game, where people compete to stay on top of a continuously shifting landscape, discovering new builds and strategies, new synergies and combos, new ways to make old things work, and so on.

Sure, this resonates more with PvP in an ARPG, but the basic principle still holds for the rest of the game, too.

WotC releases a new expansion of several hundred cards every few months, which makes quite an impact on the metagame all at once, whereas we release a few new skills/supports, a few new Uniques here and there. Of course, we still do larger content patches every so often in addition to the weeklies.

I envy how WotC can plan their expansions so far in advance, thus ensuring a regular "patch schedule"...

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HopTortoise написал:

You seem to be focusing on standard a lot, which a lot of people never bothered with.

What I said also applies to Extended, Modern, Commander, Legacy, Vintage, etc. etc.

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HopTortoise написал:

I am NOT used to having my tactics be nerfed, changed, or otherwise altered in any way shape or form DURING a tournament.

We don't patch during 3-hour races, which is the analogue. MtG doesn't have week-long events, but it does have year-long ones, which are affected by new expansions.

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HopTortoise написал:

also, the rule changes that happen are generally in regards to EMERGENCIES.

Not always. Most errata and changes to the banned/restricted lists happen after several months.

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HopTortoise написал:

anybody new who shows up and wants to buy some booster packs...well, they get shittier cards on average than the people who were around longer. WHAT? lol.

Well, if you could reroll your Magic cards, it would be a pretty different game, wouldn't it?

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Hilbert написал:

I am pretty sure that's wrong I played that game when it was quite(5-6 years or so) new and the first edition had cards like Moxen, Black Lotus, Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Time Vault which allowed to pull of one to three turn kill combinations.

Bro, the first edition (Alpha) is almost 20 years old now. But yeah, there were definitely some broken cards, which allowed turn 1 kills sometimes. Most of these are banned or restricted in most formats, though.

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HopTortoise написал:

Every time you spend orbs on that 2h sword, you aren't "rerolling" it. You are pulling one sword out of the deck of all possible swords, at the cost of currency/time.

Rerolling isn't the same as pulling a brand new card, because you can reroll very specific things: sockets, socket colours, links, mods, mod values, implicit mod values, etc.

In Magic, you can't really say "I want a card just like this one but with more Power/Toughness", at least most of the time.

In the particular case of rolling mods, which probably has the highest number of random outcomes, perhaps the correct MtG analogy is that of buying booster packs while looking for a specific rare. You only get one rare per pack, and there might be 100 possible rares in the given expansion, but you can spend a few bucks to spin the wheel. Maybe you get lucky and crack one straight away, maybe you end up opening two whole booster boxes and don't get any.

Of course, comparing rerolling to pulling new cards has one glaring flaw: in Magic, you still get to keep the old cards, so while you might not get what you want, you at least get something, perhaps something you can trade for what you actually want. Not so with rerolling items in PoE.

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HopTortoise написал:

I'm saying it might be worth your while to actually write down the list of things that you reserve the right to change, and the things that you guarantee NOT to change.

I'm not convinced making arbitrary promises is always a good thing. WotC intensely regrets ever making the Reserved List, the list of cards they have "promised" to never reprint.
Of course, there are some things we won't ever change, such as F2P-not-P2W, etc. but you knew that. And, clearly, we reserved the right to modify the item mod pool.

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HopTortoise написал:

There is no new card you are inventing when you want it with "more toughness" as your example.

The deck in this game is much larger. The card with more toughness on it already exists. Every card exists, and each card is entirely separate. The sword with 3 damage instead of 4 damage are not the same cards. They are entirely different cards.

For instance if you have a 2h sword with the given mods, there would be a separate card in the space of all possible cards for each state involving sockets, links, and colors as well.

The ONLY difference is that you are throwing away one card for a new card, and can sometimes slightly direct the outcome or direction you want to go in.

It's still the exact same thing, in the end. The items in this game ARE the cards, and your player is the deck.

Right. This is exactly what I was saying.

The only differences in the analogy are that in PoE you can control things to some extent (by choosing to use Fuses/Chromatics/Chaos/etc.) and that you don't get to keep the old item.