[3.25] Ice Dancing Queen - Icestorm/Cyclone/CI - Viable For Everything

Just something worth considering is that much of what we might gain from the Crucible trees could be in the form of attributes, rather than spell damage or spell crit, etc. Vile Staff is a Warstaff base, and there will almost certainly be a distinction that prevents it from rolling caster mods when populating the tree.

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whiterockxx написал:

@kelvynn
I was messing with my low budget crit version that will be my league start and made a provisory tree. lvl 90 tree, no jewels needed, only basic items!

https://poeplanner.com/b/DRL

I have other ideas on trying to freeze bosses and use cold mastery increase damage per second freezed, but this ideas will be implemented only on endgame tree coz will be expensive.

Hope you guys enjoy and share your thoughts and ideas for a good league start!

The main problem with the crit version is the need to invest in all those crit clusters. So far I see some interesting solutions for lv 100 with expensive gear. But getting there may not be as pleasant as the normal version that has a smooth scaling from lv 70 beginner mapping to the very top end.

Gonna think on it a bit more before the league start.

Good.. so, if we have a Vile Staff (Warstaff base), and they decided to randomly generate the nodes of the tree, relying only on the base level and the type of base - then we're fucked.(low-level base and type of staff designed for close combat)

But for some reason it seems to me that this is why they separated Unique items and Rare ones. Because there can be quite a lot of interesting, necessary, Unique low-level items that can be used in the middle and even at the end of the build.

So, I have a small hope that they didn't shit themselves with Unique items and paid special attention to them..

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Kelvynn написал:

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whiterockxx написал:

@kelvynn
I was messing with my low budget crit version that will be my league start and made a provisory tree. lvl 90 tree, no jewels needed, only basic items!

https://poeplanner.com/b/DRL

I have other ideas on trying to freeze bosses and use cold mastery increase damage per second freezed, but this ideas will be implemented only on endgame tree coz will be expensive.

Hope you guys enjoy and share your thoughts and ideas for a good league start!

The main problem with the crit version is the need to invest in all those crit clusters. So far I see some interesting solutions for lv 100 with expensive gear. But getting there may not be as pleasant as the normal version that has a smooth scaling from lv 70 beginner mapping to the very top end.

Gonna think on it a bit more before the league start.

Like others have said, @Whiterockxx was the main person helping everyone with the crit version and deserves all the credit for pushing the benefits of a crit build. He was a great aid and inspiration to me when experimenting, for sure. One of the things I love about this WI Trickster build though is it’s extremely adaptable and you can do crit a few different ways. I took a different path in making a crit variant with good results for me.

I didn't really get to play the league in earnest for like a month after it started and my freetime is sort of erratic bc of my glamorous single full-time dad lifestyle, so it took me longer than most to get to endpoint, but a side-effect was that one way I keep things interesting for me was experimenting and trying different things between the base build and Whiterock's version And I hit 40/40 challenges for the first time too.

Tree/Build Numbers
Something that could be helpful with the route I ended up going is the pathing is closer to the original build, which perhaps could give some different options in leveling and rounding things out. Basically I tried for a best of both worlds approach where I could retain some of the attribute/defensive elements and jewel sockets of the main build and keep a similarly long path for split personality, while grabbing crit useful stuff that was more centrally located around this path. Keeping the tree a bit more spread out means it is easier to experiment/adapt.

I finished with 2600 +int, 14k energy shield, and also still fit in 50/27 spell/attack block, and excellent damage (numbers a bit further below).
Liinks for Poe.ninja and a PoB import for what I did are below. If you just want to look up the poe.ninja page, my character is on the WI Trickster ladder as Syndanicus

Poeninja link: https://poe.ninja/pob/VwV
PoB link Poeninja version: https://pastebin.com/muu7gbfL

If you compare my PoB on the poe.ninja ladder for Whispering Ice tricksters to Whiterock’s, at first glance, my damage is a just a bit lower (1.4m per shard hit vs 1.6m for Whiterock's version) as the way they configure damage is based off of average hit. This is misleading though for my variant, since I ran Ambush and Assassinate for my forbidden jewel and the damage boost when hitting monsters on full/low life that isn't reflected in the PoN average hit. Using PoN configuration these numbers are 1.83m per shard at full life and 1.88m for full life.

I personally like what you get from Ambush and Assassinate a bit better as an option for a forbidden jewel in a crit variant. You get solid damage mods, get culling strike for free, and you only have to hit 50% crit chance via tree/gear for 100% effective crit chance at both full and low life.

It's also worth noting that the configuration that poe ninja defaults to is also generally underselling the damage you're doing with crit. When I configure PoB a bit more accurately and enable things like being unnerved/exposure my top-end numbers were more like 2.2 m average hit per shard and 2.56m/2.63m on full or low life for guardian/pinnacle bosses.

PoB link more accurately configured: https://pastebin.com/cceNdxsN

Auras
@ Kelvynn you mentioned a benefit of these new balance changes running an extra and fitting in Hatred. I think Zealotry beats Hatred for a crit variant as it synergizes better for crit IMO, especially alongside bottled faith, and there are also some solid watcher's eye options.

I also personally like to run lv1 precision as that opens up some solid options with WE the mod 'gain a flask charge on a critical strike’. With that mod you're going to be able to get close to 100% uptime on flasks as long as you're doing damage.

Last league the auras I ran with PoE, Discipline, Zealotry, Precision, Clarity, Aspect of the Spider with a bit of extra mana res efficiency from my sanctified relic (which is also where I grabbled ghost reaver, which isn't reflected on my tree). The mana res I received from the relic is pretty much interchangeable with the new MRE option from the mana mastery.

Other stuff
This crit variant of the build doesn’t require a timeless jewel (I did experiment with the one Whiterock uses), and uses a BFS/FM, and leaves 2 jewel slots to use flexibly as needed (I used these for crit multiplier and attributes).

My body armor last league was somewhat untraditional (and actually not ideal in a lot of ways--only an increased % int and no flat int or increased % attributes and not a great base) but I did recover 4 tree points I could use as needed to gain more int/damage and help balance out attributes, etc. by getting the cast an additional curse mod from my body armor vs the tree.
A body armor more like what you saw from other WI trickster ladder characters is eminently viable when you plug that in on PoB and adjust to free up the tree points to gain the extra curse there. Ideally, I would have liked something more like those myself but late league options are less plentiful and I wasn’t totally successful trying to craft one.

Going with to a more traditional body armor option, you lose a bit of damage in some cases (generally confined to when you are not hitting enemies on full or low life), but get even more ES and potentially other benefits. I had a few I briefly swapped in and tested a few other armors and there wasn’t really much noticeable difference in the damage results in actual play and again, there some nice defensive bumps (e.g. I was at 16k energy shield with a body armor more like Whiterock’s), but I ended up sticking with what I had because I had plenty of defense already. I wasn’t squishy at all.

Hopefully looking at some of this is helpful. Thanks @ Kelvynn for a great build and one of the best guides I’ve ever used. Really love how everyone has shared ideas so consistently in this thread.

An interesting side effect of instant leech is that your offensive capabilities also help with defenses. That might make the more glass cannon variants be much tankier and be preferable, all things considered.

Looking forward to more knowledgeable/available people to weight the pros and cons! The masteries rework is awesome. I'll definitely try the build for my SSF challenge this league. Instant leech might just be what I need to finally get the fourth voidstone.

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WinterHiko написал:

An interesting side effect of instant leech is that your offensive capabilities also help with defenses. That might make the more glass cannon variants be much tankier and be preferable, all things considered.

The most important thing is not die with one shots even for Uber pinnacle bosses. If you reach this point doenst matter if you have 8k or 15K ES, you'll recover full ES before the second high hit, this is one of the reasons why I left block for way more damage via critical strikes.

Now that we can use the Armor / ES mastery that convert phys damage from hits to chaos and the Evasion / ES mastery that absurdly increases the evasion rate plus the instant leach, 10k ES should be more then enought to make all game content easly. But keep in mind that to make Uber Pinnacle you need more damage then survivability and know the boss mechanics coz if you dont have damage you keep playing lottery against one shots.

And i'm still betting on Freeze Bosses with the new Notable passives that would be awesome if work... but we will discovery it only in the day 4-5 of the league where i'm expect to have all endgame gear, damage enought and start trying the uber bosses.

@Vahkerr so you played 2 versions of WI

which one was better for you? Did you feel like you can die somhow?

I see that the critical variant of whiterockxx has a lot of dmg, but in the video some mobs with essence hit it with about 80% hp... I don't like even the possibility of death in maps

I only played the non critical version of Kelvinn without HATRED)))) because it was problematic to buy a 72 lvl helmet with enchant at the end of the league... ( and i think it was not nessesery, build worked just fine without Hatred)

@whiterockxx to freeze bosses, what do you want to use? The expedition's end?

It's rly interesting node but i dont rly know how to freeze ubers

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santjohn написал:

@Vahkerr so you played 2 versions of WI
which one was better for you? Did you feel like you can die somhow?
I see that the critical variant of whiterockxx has a lot of dmg, but in the video some mobs with essence hit it with about 80% hp... I don't like even the possibility of death in maps
I only played the non critical version of Kelvinn without HATRED)))) because it was problematic to buy a 72 lvl helmet with enchant at the end of the league... ( and i think it was not nessesery, build worked just fine without Hatred)

Kelvynn version is way more beginner friendly. When leave layers of defense behind for damage you better know what you aiming for, know boss mechanics coz you wont be able to tank everyting.
The crit version is like a glass cannon. Awesome curency maker but die.
If you want lvl 100 just do Flawless Chayula rotas or pay a 5-way pusher with the extra currency the build does.

This league i'll be carrying Flawless Chayulas Rotas at day 4-5 to hit lvl 100 with the setup of video below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYcHinlbZFQ

That is how Crit version do Flawless Chayula Breachstone.

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santjohn написал:

@whiterockxx to freeze bosses, what do you want to use? The expedition's end?

It rly interesting node but i dont rly know how to freeze ubers

All critical hits aways freeze enemies, but the duration is based on the magnitude of the hit.

But to enemy be effectivly frozen, the duration must be over 0,3 seconds. And i think the cen be reached now increasing the freeze duration with the new notable passive nodes:

The Breath of Rime Notable Passive Skill no longer has 50% increased Effect of Cold Ailments. Instead, it now has 50% increased Duration of Cold Ailments.

Winter's Embrace provides 60% increased Freeze Duration on Enemies.

The video below is from actual league, i'm alerdy Freezing the Chayula on a Pure Breachstone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUu9z6CzHFI

Probably Ubers wont be able to be frozen, but Regular Pinnacle probably will.