[3.19] Ice Dancing Queen - Icestorm/Cyclone/CI - Viable For Everything

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Wolfye01 написал:

Made this reddit post guys https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/secm11/is_the_whispering_ice_buff_still_a_nerf_or_am_i/

so in case i missed something please let me know in there. Let's hope GGG just didn't realize this and will fix it

Thanks, man! And now we wait again.

Per the posts and tests on reddit (thanks pam) the 60% applied to the support skills only, NOT the base damage. So it's not quite as good as if it did apply to base damage.

We did get a small buff looks like.

And definitely a motivation to see if we can avoid Cast While.. gems -- somehow.

Hey -- from Beth:

You're right! It looks like the Added Damage effectiveness was not applying to the base Cold Damage per Intelligence. We'll get that fixed and are also looking at adjusting the damage per Intelligence from Icestorm. Upwards, not downwards.

We're back, baby!! Thanks to everyone who contributed!

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Graiaule написал:

Hey -- from Beth:

You're right! It looks like the Added Damage effectiveness was not applying to the base Cold Damage per Intelligence. We'll get that fixed and are also looking at adjusting the damage per Intelligence from Icestorm. Upwards, not downwards.

We're back, baby!! Thanks to everyone who contributed!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M

So, i modified my PoB to simulate the damage buffs to the 3~5 And these are the results.

If we get a buff to 4~6 we get 12.4% less damage on the budget version and 12.5% less damage on the final version

If we get 5~7 it's a 5.11% increase on budget and 4.973% increase on final

If we get 6~8 it's a 22.62% increase on budget and 22.4692% increase on final

Keep in mind this is also with the 30% less damage on CWC


So lets hope for 5~7 or 6~8, OR lets hope they love us and give us 7~9(A man can dream)

It seems there is a lot of confusion around the term "Damage effectiveness".

The base damage of all skill gems is based on gem level flat values, or on a % of a stat or if an attack skill a % of the weapon's base damage. For Icestorm this base dmg is instead based on Intelligence rather than gem level. This base value is not dependent on any effectiveness.

So this is not a bug as someone from GGG posted, it is intended. There is nothing to "fix" in this sense.

Damage effectiveness only applies to the skill in question where there are external sources of flat added damage to attacks or spells (that is not from the gem itself - in this case from the skill innate stat).

For Icestorm the tooltip clearly states "Deals 3 to 5 base cold damage per 10 Intelligence". This is base damage, an innate property of the skill and does not get scaled by damage effectiveness.

So Intelligence has always been a direct means of adding flat damage at 100% value to this build.

It is also going to remain the primary mod to scale damage instead of sources such as "Added cold damage to spells" from Abyss jewels for example. If the damage effectiveness was raised over 100% then perhaps it may be more worthwhile to invest in these mods - but they are kind of weak and the buffs are as I understand coming to weapons flat added spell damage mods that we can't get on this build anyway.

A practical example to finish off my comment: The lab boot enchant that "Adds cold damage if you've been hit recently" is now added as flat damage to Icestorm at 100% of its value in 3.17 instead of only 60% of it.

Hi Lingen, it's been a while!

To summarize your post, it seems you are saying the 60% to 100% change will have minimal practical effect (including our support gems) and the overall effect of the league changes will be 30% less damage for WI builds due to the CwC change?

That seems to match pam's POB testing, also.

Let's hope for 8-10 flat damage per 10 int if so... (or a level 5 or so icestorm.)

Well then mb make another reddit post?)
To be sure that they buff icestorm correctly to compensate cwc nerf

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Graiaule написал:

Hi Lingen, it's been a while!

To summarize your post, it seems you are saying the 60% to 100% change will have minimal practical effect (including our support gems)

Yes.

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Graiaule написал:

...and the overall effect of the league changes will be 30% less damage for WI builds due to the CwC change?

That seems to match pam's POB testing, also.

Let's hope for 8-10 flat damage per 10 int if so... (or a level 5 or so icestorm.)

The More multiplier will be 30% less if using CwC. However, they have confirmed they are going to increase the base damage. So the final number will depend on how much they raise the damage.

I did some testing in PoB to get a picture of it.

Assuming you have 2500 Intelligence in 3.16 with no other sources of flat added damage you deal 750 - 1250 base cold damage per iceshard (3 to 5 * 250). For simplicity I use the mean values instead (avg hit). Currently in 3.16 that is 4 cold damage per 10 int - so this means we do 1000 base cold damage per hit, simple number to start out from.

Historically GGG has buffed the base damage of Icestorm by 1 digit every time. So I would assume they will do the same this time. Here are some examples:

1. If they raise it to 5 (4-6): 250 * 5 = 1250

2. If to 6 (5-7): 250 * 6 = 1500

3. If 7: 1750

(and so on...)

Let's see. If 1000 base damage is Increased by 750% (realistic example with %spell dmg per int and the rest) and then multiplied by 470% More (Elemental Overload+Arcane Surge+Controlled Destruction+Elemental Focus+Concentrated Effect) we get: 1000 * 8.5 * 5.7 = 48 450

Ok so 48 450 is our damage now.

In 3.17 CwC will have a Less modifier so we get a weaker More multiplier (5.7*0.7) = 3.99

Scenario 1: 1250 * 8.5 * (5.7*0.7) = ~ 42 394

Scenario 2: 1500 * 8.5 * 3.99 = ~ 50 873

Scenario 3: 1750 * 8.5 * 3.99 = ~ 59 351

So yeah I arrived at the same numbers as @pamintandrei. I think its easier to just multiply the new base damage by 0.7, really other additive and multiplicative mods doesn't change this ratio.

I guess we should hope for at least scenario 2 with a new damage of 5 to 7 cold damage per 10 int to not get worse dmg than before. However, GGG has been clear with how they want the direction to be headed (triggered skills are getting nerfed and selfcasting buffed).

Too bad self-cast feels awful.