Steamchart - doesnt look too healthy?! :/

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Aelloon написал:

PoE is just too hardcore. And yes, you can whine about games being trivialized like WoW but that's what the masses want: they want easy gameplay. PoE does not deliver on it, not in it being easy nor not being frustrating.

Easy gameplay? It's a hack n slash. It's as easy as it gets. RNG isn't "difficult". Doing 100 map runs for 800 Alteration Orbs in trash loot isn't "difficult". It's boring.

If I wanted to play something difficult and frustrating I would play SC2 on a Korean server.

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nGio написал:

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Aelloon написал:

PoE is just too hardcore. And yes, you can whine about games being trivialized like WoW but that's what the masses want: they want easy gameplay. PoE does not deliver on it, not in it being easy nor not being frustrating.

Easy gameplay? It's a hack n slash. It's as easy as it gets.

Tell that to the 50% of Steam players who didn't even manage to kill Brutus.

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Xavderion написал:

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nGio написал:

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Aelloon написал:

PoE is just too hardcore. And yes, you can whine about games being trivialized like WoW but that's what the masses want: they want easy gameplay. PoE does not deliver on it, not in it being easy nor not being frustrating.

Easy gameplay? It's a hack n slash. It's as easy as it gets.

Tell that to the 50% of Steam players who didn't even manage to kill Brutus.

didnt 'manage to kill' or 'got bored and left'? outcome is the same - no money from mtx. but identyfing a source is needed to fix the issue. because people leaving game after less than 30 minutes IS an issue

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Tell that to the 50% of Steam players who didn't even manage to kill Brutus.

That does most likely not reflect on the difficulty, but people trying the game (becuase F2P) a short while.

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sidtherat написал:

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Xavderion написал:

Tell that to the 50% of Steam players who didn't even manage to kill Brutus.

didnt 'manage to kill' or 'got bored and left'? outcome is the same - no money from mtx. but identyfing a source is needed to fix the issue. because people leaving game after less than 30 minutes IS an issue

If 'got bored and left' is true then nothing will prevent those people from getting bored. It's also not an issue since a lot of people simply don't like ARPGs. Did you know that 70% of trial players in WoW don't make it past level 10? http://kotaku.com/5469238/most-new-world-of-warcraft-players-dont-go-past-level-10

The main reason for steady playerbase drop off is the ONGOING problems that haunt this game from the begining about which nothing is being done about. Seriously people , nothing ingame is viable. Except preset patterns other players have followed.

And the problem behind the unusable trade chat, the fact that this is the most NEWB UNFRIENDLY GAME EVER CREATED due to heavy lack of descriptions and constant need to alt tab to check shit on web or even reading months before you even open the fucking game. Not to mention scams on new folks due to no AH.

This game is amazing, but it has equally fucked up draw backs.

The WORST problem for this game is the skill tree.

It has FAR too many NODES no one ever picks (anyone ever got Move Speed clusters? Less skill mana cost nodes?) Most of it is jack shit. Not to mention 1'281931231'20310 unviable builds just cuz there are preset paths in the tree that dont make it work other wise.

The problem is the Scion Class. Dont get me wrong, i play for 3 months, and all my characters are scions. Why? Viability and flexibility.

This game either has to Remove the SCION, or remove all the other existing classes.
Because, the idea of this game was as far as I understood it, that all classes can be anything?

And then, you get the class that goes in the middle of the tree to become anything more easily?

Do you see the problem? Why would anyone go which and then go shitload away to other part of the tree? Just take scion and go 50% top and 50% bottom. The idea of multiclass defys the "area Class clusters" because originaly there was a point to playing a certain class.

To me, they should just remove scion and put all keystones into the middle. Keystones are so and so gamebreakers that change your whole character, so making them easly accessible in middle would greatly improve flexibility on all characters.

This way you have to spend way too much points traveling the tree to even TRY the build you think it might work, making it pretty hard on the new players, and REALLY LIMITING YOUR BUILD OPTIONS. Kick the scion out. And make a tree that allows easy char specialization in the middle of the tree. Keystones arent that imba tbh. Most of them suck.

This game needs a talent tree rework badly. 1350 skill nodes? Great. Now how many of them are actually picked by players? Around 500 at tops. Way too much unusable shit in unviable parts of the tree that just makes you sick and sad you cant make a build the way you want it. Or, it needs at least 20+ points for builds via quests or smth.

Just my 2 cents. Many people find it way frustrating when you think you will have a free style play style by doing what you want in skill tree, then realize 99% of that shit aint viable and usable. Fucked up.


Its the idea of No Class Classes that really sucks as no class is DEFINED to go a certain way. They all can go a certain way. But Scion Exceedes them all at it. So either remove him or allow the original No Class Classes concept to flourish. Or remove all classes and have 1 No class Class that can become anything like originally intended.

I suspect some people want low playing figures, keeps the pleb's out and asking for sensible interface/game changes

Most of you in this thread do not understand why the numbers are the way they are. You project your own issues onto the game, and then use the graph to justify them.

Spoiler: A new player that drops the game before Brutus does not care about the trade chat, has likely never noticed desync, never spotted any issue with loot, is not worried about "difficulty", doesn't care about uniques and does not know about any "balance issue" with the permanent tree.

These are YOUR issues, and regardless how valid you may think they are, a player who played less than two hours won't care jack about any of them.


They stopped playing because they weren't into the kind of game, because another game attracted their attention, because their mom took their PC away, in short: GGG cannot make changes based on that group. Just like Blizzard would be absolutely insane to make changes based on most(!) of the players quitting before they reach level 10.

These are people that did not find the very basic core gameplay engaging enough to keep playing. In other words: NOT the target audience. They will never be. Appeasing that group is foolish, not only because these players are already lost to GGG, but also because appeasing them would mean changing PoEs basic gameplay.


If you want changes, you need to find logical reasons to support your changes instead. This graph will make GGGs staff likely ignore any point you make, because using it shows GGG that you don't know what you are talking about and/or are willingly twisting the truth to serve your own needs.


Look, I agree the loot in this game isn't too good so far. I also agree that the trade system is a complete mess.

But...that doesn't mean I agree that using statistics utterly wrong is okay. It's not. Stop it.

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This game either has to Remove the SCION, or remove all the other existing classes.
Because, the idea of this game was as far as I understood it, that all classes can be anything?

And then, you get the class that goes in the middle of the tree to become anything more easily?

Do you see the problem? Why would anyone go which and then go shitload away to other part of the tree? Just take scion and go 50% top and 50% bottom. The idea of multiclass defys the "area Class clusters" because originaly there was a point to playing a certain class.

To me, they should just remove scion and put all keystones into the middle. Keystones are so and so gamebreakers that change your whole character, so making them easly accessible in middle would greatly improve flexibility on all characters.

Absolutely awful ideas here. Keystones are game changers and should thus be as spread out as they are. That is why they are so spread - that's good design. What you want would be a complete mess that would stifle builds utterly.

If all keystones are easily available, then keystones are not actually choices anymore, as builds lack opportunity cost. Builds simply will have to pick the best ones, and the end result will be far, far less viable builds - the best ones are nearby, and so you'll just have a set of best ones, and a set nobody picks. We might just remove the whole lot then.

The way things are set up now is good, because it makes quantifying builds way harder - there actually are viable alternate paths as it is now. And this is created in large parts because of the opportunity cost associated with getting the keystones.

The more you homogenize the tree and make it "accessible", the more you also homogenize builds. Remember a certain Star Wars game, and what they did to Jedis?

Enjoy similar when the scion gets removed here. Which is why GGG thankfully is very, very unlikely to do so. They likely know better than that.

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These are people that did not find the very basic core gameplay engaging enough to keep playing. In other words: NOT the target audience. They will never be. Appeasing that group is foolish, not only because these players are already lost to GGG, but also because appeasing them would mean changing PoEs basic gameplay.

That's true but there is also no point in targeting people who have been playing a a year either as the amount of money you are likely to get of them is going to go down with time (its all about real world money in the end).

If you don't get new people each year bringing in 10's of dollars/pounds you will go under, can't rely on a small hardcore group to fund it

Obviously, you need new people - but you can't appeal to people who won't find the core gameplay appealing.

It just doesn't work like that. Nearly ANYTHING has statistics like that. Anything. Coffee, Baby shoes, kinds of apples, tampons, bathing milk, my makeup - anything and everything.

Companies that see these statistics and foolishly try to turn their product into what it's not to appease the "missed sales" are companies that fail.


What you need for new people is, instead
-Good word of mouth
-Good publicity
-Marketing presence

Notice that only one of these is gained by appeasing the actual users, and neither is gained by appeasing the not-users. What successful companies usually do is
-Keep remaining users happy enough
-Avoid major bad PR due to product failures of catastrophic proportions
-Pay for marketing and good publicity


So really, all GGG needs to do is make token efforts to fight desync, make a minor trading overhaul and an equally minor loot overhaul, and then work on several patches that will all land on big gaming sites due to sounding cool.


[Again, keep in mind that I agree that trading is a catastrophy and that there really should be better ways of getting upgrades - really, use vendor recipes more, GGG! I am NOT saying that everything is perfect!]