"This loot system is flawed and needs to change!!"

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potaco написал:

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findangle написал:

the problem with simply "setting an option" that allows loot to be distributed more advantageously, is that doesn't actually present a new option for players who want it without removing the old option for players who want that. once you open up a method for players to satisfy their gear goal without trading, they have no reason to participate in trade. This need to participate in trade is what makes the other option attractive to those players.

you need a solution that prevents the disparity of wealth, without allowing players to satisfy their gear requirements completely outside of the intended trade mechanics.

How would such an option satisfy all of a player's gear requirements without trading any more so than the current system? The loot would still be random and would still be randomly assigned... you would just have more time to claim it.

because the system is partially balanced around the idea that you will not actually get to all the drops with your name on them in time and other players will swoop and scoop. if you started actually nailing "your" drops at a higher rate because of a longer timer, your going to end up with your drops sooner rather than later. later is what the game is presently built for.

you must also realize, people behave differently under time constraints (even reasonable ones) than they do without them. this is one of the reasons chess has a timer. if you have a much larger or infinite amount of time to stare and compare between whats in your bag and whats on the floor there is a much higher chance your going to take just the best gear and leave the rest to rot or get scooped.

there is a balance of gear that is expected to get vendor'ed or rot or end up in someones inventory not getting used, and when you start to mess with those numbers (by removing pressure from a players decision making for example) you lose efficiency in gear leaving the system/economy. now you must start re-adjusting drop rates (read: nerf) and mucking with award rotations to prevent people from increasing the rate at which they end up with their preferred gear configuration.


basically, it is the way it is to slow people down from getting to the min/maxed "best" gear configuration. yes it's a somewhat frustrating way of inhibiting this, but changing it would also mean adding new mechanics to make sure that it doesn't allow you to get into your preferred setup any faster.

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Aurlon написал:

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Delmas написал:

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potaco написал:

A) It is "my" loot, just for a specified amount of time.
B) Option for party leader: "[checkbox] Add __ seconds to loot timer." Or even make it a percent so it scales for melee/ranged. Update some code to take the number into account and that's that.

C) (which you avoided twice) How would such an option hurt anyone?

A) No it is not, the devs have stated this several times, get it through your thick skull, it is simply your opportunity to get that piece of loot first.
B) Waste of development time
C) See B

If the only response to loot mechanic discussions is to flame and berate anyone with a differing opinion than you, this discussion is going to go nowhere helpful.

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Tandimonium написал:

Stop thinking that the game needs to change for you.

Stop thinking that the game needs to stay the same for you.

took two words I have said on the topic of thousands and called them my only, just lol

I am playing the game the devs put forth, I have a lot of respect for these guys and feel they know what they are doing. It is their game and I will play it or I won't.\

If you are constantly going to try to conform the game to your own personal preference you should just make your own.

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potaco написал:

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Delmas написал:

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potaco написал:

A) It is "my" loot, just for a specified amount of time.
B) Option for party leader: "[checkbox] Add __ seconds to loot timer." Or even make it a percent so it scales for melee/ranged. Update some code to take the number into account and that's that.

C) (which you avoided twice) How would such an option hurt anyone?

A) No it is not, the devs have stated this several times, get it through your thick skull, it is simply your opportunity to get that piece of loot first.
B) Waste of development time
C) See B

A) Semantics. It's like saying you don't really own a game because you simply bought a license for it. If it's allocated to me (and ONLY me), it's mine for that duration of time.

B) In your opinion, maybe.

C) Hypothetically speaking, assuming it was trivial to implement, what's the harm?

A) Wrong, you license the right to play it. You do not own anything. (No really, look it up)
B) No, it is, there are already games that cater to what you want.
C) Waste of development time (Covered this already BTW)

I agree with the original post. The FFA loot system is very appealing, and I'm getting tired of responding to people wanting it changed.

Why I think it shouldn't be changed (copy-pasting what I've said before):

"It removes the rush that item drops in a competitive public party can bring. When you remove the risk factor of having 'your' loot 'stolen' the game can become dull.

10+ years of Diablo 2, and to this day if I get on my 92 bone necro and join a baal run I still have a rush when I see the boss go down knowing I'll be competing against others for a chance at something amazing. I remember the first Stone of Jordan I had 'stolen' from me (I fucking had that grab, but I guess not), but I also remember snatching my first Windforce from seven other people.

When you work and put in effort into not just obtaining loot, but picking it up as well there is an immense level of satisfaction when you finally find something worth keeping.

I don't want that rush to be ruined a few weeks into open beta just because the people who want to play this game for ~1-3 months want guaranteed loot."

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Delmas написал:

It is yours because your build would use it? This is not well defined, but if I were playing with you(I wouldn't) I probably give it to you if you said you would use it.

Nice, but most players who are ninjas don't do that.

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Tandimonium написал:

Sir, please step out of the Azeroth portal and look around...No one cares that you were too slow to get the loot. It is not yours, and will never be yours unless you man up and get into the action, or trade for it. It doesn't matter who it fits best with, if I find a pair of speedos before you THEN THEY ARE MINE! Go cry about it while I do the safety dance!

I never played WoW so I cannot comply.

And as several of us stated before:
Because of the loot system we play solo, where everything is ours.
But always playing solo is completely retarded for an online game.

Also you could step out of your Diablo2 Portal.
All we ever hear from FFA-likers is "It's like that, deal with it"
Rational arguments seem to be rare in D2-Land, they shouldn't be rare in Wraeclast.

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Delmas написал:

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potaco написал:

A) Semantics. It's like saying you don't really own a game because you simply bought a license for it. If it's allocated to me (and ONLY me), it's mine for that duration of time.

B) In your opinion, maybe.

C) Hypothetically speaking, assuming it was trivial to implement, what's the harm?

A) My point stands your response may be the dumbest thing I have heard in a while.

B)Stands.

C)I feel it will be detrimental to the integrity of the game.

A) If that's the dumbest thing you've heard in awhile, your account must be bugged so you can't view your own posts. For all intents and purposes, the loot is mine while that timer is ticking down. After that, it's fair game.

B) Stating an opinion doesn't make it fact.

C) In what way? You not being able to click a piece of loot that was already temporarily/randomly allocated to someone else anyway because they weren't able to click on it fast enough? That's not game integrity; that's player greed.

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Delmas написал:

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Zenn3k написал:

FFA loot just teaches new players the grouping = bad.

If you think the game is going to survive by teaching new players that playing with others is a bad idea, you're deluding yourself.


Replace "Timer" with "Lock", meaning that if an item drops with a set name on it (as current), it can only be picked up by that person.

That solves item theft on items that are suppose to be "yours".
It DOES NOT make loot instanced, and avoids all the problems related to that.
Better still, it helps encourage MULTIPLAYER.

Why should I group with other people if it means only getting 10% of loot I'd normally be getting? Besides some XP, which is really just about time spent...there is no honest benefit.

I don't want PoE to be a solo ONLY game, however, thats currently exactly what it is.

1st, the items were never yours.
2nd, it only teaches bad players that grouping is bad.
3rd, game will survive with or without you.

Delmas, you're an idiot.

1: If I solo, anything on the screen is "mine". It only STOP being "mine" when I introduce another player, so why should I EVER do that? Can you kindly answer that question? Why should I EVER group? Why? There is no benefit, only negatives.
2: Arrogance, pure arrogance. Skill in playing the game has NO relation to ability to click on items on the ground, kindly STFU.
3: Maybe, maybe not. It certainly does not help incoming revenue to allow anyone who attempts to play with others to have a bad experience.

Agreed 100% with the OP.

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KorganBloodaxe написал:

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Delmas написал:

It is yours because your build would use it? This is not well defined, but if I were playing with you(I wouldn't) I probably give it to you if you said you would use it.

Nice, but most players who are ninjas don't do that.

You would be suprised, back when I played public parties(before losing my first hardcore character to some idiots shitty tp) Most all of the people I played with would be very considerate with the loot. I did however only play groups with people who used VoIP. Forcing groups u play with to use VoIP has 2 major benefits I have found, 1 it weeds out huge canoes, 2 it make the group more personable.

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Zenn3k написал:

Delmas, you're an idiot.

1: If I solo, anything on the screen is "mine". It only STOP being "mine" when I introduce another player, so why should I EVER do that? Can you kindly answer that question? Why should I EVER group? Why? There is no benefit, only negatives.
2: Arrogance, pure arrogance. Skill in playing the game has NO relation to ability to click on items on the ground, kindly STFU.
3: Maybe, maybe not. It certainly does not help incoming revenue to allow anyone who attempts to play with others to have a bad experience.

1: Nothing when you solo is your until you pick it up. Good luck trading something without picking it up first.
2. Good players will get the loot before the timer runs out, I see no arrogance here.
3. I am starting to believe the game would, infact, be better without you. The way you talk, you simply joining another persons party will likely make it a bad experience for them