VP was never the problem

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Xavathos написал:

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relithh написал:

why is there even a discussion ? everything that is fun will get killed. thats how this game works. do not invest in anything.

Fun is a relative term. You may find it fun to be playing games with god mode on. While personally, the idea of watching paint dry while eating cacti and having a bath in a tub full of broken glass sounds rather more fun.

then again, noone's forcing you into VP (it's not THAT good), so VP being like it is doesn't inhibit your fun in any way.

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shaunika90 написал:

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Xavathos написал:

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relithh написал:

why is there even a discussion ? everything that is fun will get killed. thats how this game works. do not invest in anything.

Fun is a relative term. You may find it fun to be playing games with god mode on. While personally, the idea of watching paint dry while eating cacti and having a bath in a tub full of broken glass sounds rather more fun.

then again, noone's forcing you into VP (it's not THAT good), so VP being like it is doesn't inhibit your fun in any way.

"Not that good"? no..... are you serious..... . what the fuck? who are you trying to fool with that complete lie.

people give 20+ passives points in some cases because vp is THAT good. Holy shit.

This game has always been balanced around instant logout. Honestly ever since they started on the Xbox version the game went down hill. To GGG, killing faster with screen wide AoE is more fun game for them to market

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BaKouneT написал:

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CaptainWARLORD написал:

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BaKouneT написал:

it doesn't kill diversity, it increases it.

Aren't you one delusional fella.

As you did during the 29 previous pages, another expected ad nominem attack.

But no, I'm not. Before you had VP+nothing builds, tomorrow you will have VP+endu, or VP+dodge&evasion or VP+armor or VP+flat phys reduction instead, for me 4>1.

Yes 4.5k hp and no other defenses are probably gone, but how many will rises on their ashes? You'll never find out I guess, rest in peace little princess, peace out.

Sweeping nerfs does NOT build diversity. Fuck me I hate that word more than any other in the English language.

PoE is a game of dynamic build potential. The diversity (ugh) is in the nerfs/changes. The "diversity" in the builds is pretty consistent, however the "meta" or "best" or "most powerful" (who's definition varies depending on whether you prefer clear speed or boss killing potential) changes with each major nerf/patch/skill change/buff/etc etc.

GGG is not pulling builds out of their ass aside from the occasional skill addition. And their record on that is pretty dilute - like for every 5 skills introduced two are decent on release, one is nerfed into oblivion and one remains actually playable to a reasonable end-game state. THAT is the only actual added diversity.

someone bump this topic in 6 months when the league has been around a while and everyone has adjusted to the new VP and people still facetank shaper and 3-shotting guardians.

everything is going to be all right.

I really think they should pursue the elimination of damage spikes. It makes the combat more tactical and satisfying when you are in moments of ALMOST being dead and have to manage it. As opposed to now where you're cruising cruising... SPLAT. It's like instead of tension, you're just hit with a heart attack once in a blue moon.

It makes your armor and defenses have more meaning when you can get a tangible feeling for what it does other than a binary situation we have now.

Do I have enough defense?

Are you dead?

No.

Then you do.

I think big telegraphed one shot hits can still exist, they are well done in this game in fact, but there are far too many out of nowhere attacks that are just 5k damage for not really any reason at all. Mostly due to the way map mods work.

I don't think this will ever change though. It's a hardcore game through and through, and people like to die instantly. It reinforces that feeling. "I died because the game is hardcore."

Damage spikes are the only way ggg knows how to threaten the player with death.
GGG needs and wants players to die in order to extend their play time but players want to face roll game content.

It is hard to say where the middle ground is.

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Nephalim написал:

Damage spikes are the only way ggg knows how to threaten the player with death.
GGG needs and wants players to die in order to extend their play time but players want to face roll game content.

It is hard to say where the middle ground is.

A lot of players don't actually want to faceroll content.

If I have the choice between faceroll with instant deaths, and non-faceroll with tactical gameplay, I certainly choose the latter.

The problem is that the latter doesn't really work in PoE. You get non-faceroll mediocrely tactical gameplay that still oneshots you out of the blue every once in a while, and you still die to technical problems (disconnect, lag). Furthermore, you clear three times slower, so you earn three times less currency per time (at least, since item values deteriorate over time). So you can make less builds, because builds require currency, and some of them require retarded amounts of it. My last build I made in Standard simply because there is no way I can do it on league (it requires Acuities).


But thinking back, which fights do I remember as being fun and enjoyable in PoE?

- first Atziri attempt (I ripped hard)
- first time I killed Atziri (tactical fight, didn't have the DPS to boost her down)
- first time I killed Uber Atziri
- last few Uber Atziri attempts (I didn't actually kill her :()
- that day when a Haast spawned in a Underground River and we had to play tactically to get it down, because of hard map mods (and us being not very well geared)
- first few Shaper attempts
- first few Shaper kills
- Abaxoth, several of them
- Malachai and Core Malachai
- Several lab runs


Do I remember the fights where I just went in and insta-deleted the boss? No. Are those rewarding? No. Do I want more of them? Certainly not.

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Nephalim написал:

Damage spikes are the only way ggg knows how to threaten the player with death.
GGG needs and wants players to die in order to extend their play time but players want to face roll game content.

It is hard to say where the middle ground is.

Even this argument is not very logical since more face roll there is more drops there is to gather, more stash there is to sell.
That and the fact that a nerf might lead to some people (including paying customer) to quit the game, so less income for GGG.

From that perspective, something must be REALLY over powered to be nerfed.

Diablo 3 for all it's problems, has exceptionally well balanced monster damage. At the hardest difficulties (GRs) the damage you take is very threatening but not to the point it's ridiculous. The fights are exciting because you're always on the verge of death if you're really pushing things. There is a real ebb and flow to combat, with moments of safety intermixed with moments of stress.

However, the option still exists to drop it down difficulties and face roll like a bad ass.

PoE manages this to some degree with map tiers, but as you go higher it only means you're seeing more out of nowhere one shots.

I think managing this careful balance was a feat of game design, and one GGG either doesn't want to go after, or is simply incapable of figuring out.