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^^This is the best way to look at it. I've considered swapping to PoH a few times, but my damage is already insanely high with W&S (over 4m shaper dps) and because the survivability is, IMO, considerably higher with W&S, it just didn't seem worth making the shift in both gear and tree.

I think it honestly comes down to preference. The other thing I really like about W&S is the socketed spell trigger. You never have to worry about desecrate or your offering. They're constantly being cast thus your offering has 100% uptime.

Speaking specifically about survivability, I'm almost at max block with W&S and have around 8k health and 1.2k ES with high regen. I wouldn't trade that for more dps, especially when things already melt. But that's just me. YMMV, and you may have different preferences.

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Last league I went full in on W&S, just as you did this league. This league I went full in on PoH build. So I know I have a base to compare the two.

The W&S felt great, it was melting faces and I felt very good on defense.
However, my current Staff-build is another league: You dont see the mobs anymore since they instagib and there is only bad movement (standing still in UE beam) that can kill you. Staff is clearly > W&S in both, DPS and survivability.

W&S felt smother while playing because, as you mentioned, the auto-trigger means you can relax.
Staff-build has a higher skill-ceiling from your side since you need to know what buttons you push when. But when you reach that ceiling -> WOW, just WOW.

I am at >20Mio Shaper DPS and have 9.5k Life/ES.

Thanks again to Kayella for her input/ideas.

PS: This is my final build, I am half an item short if it.

https://pastebin.com/kv3wnBKZ

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Takanohana написал:

Last league I went full in on W&S, just as you did this league. This league I went full in on PoH build. So I know I have a base to compare the two.

The W&S felt great, it was melting faces and I felt very good on defense.
However, my current Staff-build is another league: You dont see the mobs anymore since they instagib and there is only bad movement (standing still in UE beam) that can kill you. Staff is clearly > W&S in both, DPS and survivability.

W&S felt smother while playing because, as you mentioned, the auto-trigger means you can relax.
Staff-build has a higher skill-ceiling from your side since you need to know what buttons you push when. But when you reach that ceiling -> WOW, just WOW.

I am at >20Mio Shaper DPS and have 9.5k Life/ES.

Thanks again to Kayella for her input/ideas.

PS: This is my final build, I am half an item short if it.

https://pastebin.com/kv3wnBKZ

Well shoot lol. I'm sitting on about 120ex atm... maybe I should roll PoH. Since you have played both extensively, if it feels that good, there's no reason to not give it a go. Thanks!

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Severinze написал:

Well shoot lol. I'm sitting on about 120ex atm... maybe I should roll PoH. Since you have played both extensively, if it feels that good, there's no reason to not give it a go. Thanks!

That wouldnt be enough, every single gem in that pob that can be is 21/23.

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Severinze написал:

I've considered swapping to PoH a few times, but my damage is already insanely high with W&S (over 4m shaper dps)

Do you mean including Vaal Skeletons and all other minions?
I looked at your PoB and your spectres have roughly half the dmg of what PoB says for mine.

I crafted a helm and +1 minion +1 spell wands so I can have 6 spectres without empower. I think its good but don't really know calculations and thinking about how can I get more defense and which crafts should be in my chest piece(its only a placeholder with +1 spectre) or what should i do with its sockets. So what can you advice to me?

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ElCatti написал:

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Severinze написал:

Well shoot lol. I'm sitting on about 120ex atm... maybe I should roll PoH. Since you have played both extensively, if it feels that good, there's no reason to not give it a go. Thanks!

That wouldnt be enough, every single gem in that pob that can be is 21/23.

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Severinze написал:

I've considered swapping to PoH a few times, but my damage is already insanely high with W&S (over 4m shaper dps)

Do you mean including Vaal Skeletons and all other minions?
I looked at your PoB and your spectres have roughly half the dmg of what PoB says for mine.

I haven't looked at the PoB he posted yet (at work atm), but I guess I'd have to just prioritize my purchases if I pull the trigger on making the swap.

Regarding my current spectre damage, I don't count skellies but I do count the -lightning res from zombies (ele army) and AG gives -9% as well (helm), and bonus damage to minions from gear. I do also factor in shock (ring enchant - I do this instead of Skitterbots) which I know isn't 50% more multiplier as it's not a hit, but it is 20% iirc, and then did you add in 3 stacks of AotS? My dps looks like garbage until you configure things right in PoB, but I can tell you I phase Shaper in less than 2 seconds. I can't say it's definitely not instant, but it's near-instant.

If you think I'm configuring things wrong, please correct me. Also, I know you played PoH variant before and have commented on it a bunch but that you advocate for W&S 2.0 -- so if you have any additional input, please send it over. I'd also like to see PoB links if you have them.

Oh, and if you have any thoughts on the helm I posted about last page, I'm still trying to see if there's a cool way to integrate it somehow, although it may just not be realistic. Thanks!

Just wanted to say I’m still in love with this build! I’m way slower than most players and so am far behind all you Uber elder farmers...

However, last night I hit a new milestone! I cleared Uber lab. It’s the first time ive ever gotten a shot at that last ascendency node and cleared it on my first try.

Only my third league (started when it came to PS4 with Synthesis) so I’m still fairly new but am just having fun pushing on and finding better gear and inching towards the shaper and elder battles.

That 4th ascendancy was huge too! I feel so much tankier now.

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Undicesimo написал:

I crafted a helm and +1 minion +1 spell wands so I can have 6 spectres without empower. I think its good but don't really know calculations and thinking about how can I get more defense and which crafts should be in my chest piece(its only a placeholder with +1 spectre) or what should i do with its sockets. So what can you advice to me?

That helm is really really nice man, grats. As far as going more defensive, you're gonna need to lose one of the wands and get an Elder shield with high life and % life. Coupled with Bone Offering, you'll get so much block, plus it'll probably add like 1k life if it's well rolled. Here's mine for reference:



You could post a PoB we could look at as well.

As far as chest crafts go, life + Gain 10% of life as max ES is really nice. Here's mine for reference:



Haven't decided what to do with my last suffix yet. Anyway, since you're gonna run Spectres in your helm, I would suggest running a 6L zombie setup in your chest.

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Oldsterman написал:

Just wanted to say I’m still in love with this build! I’m way slower than most players and so am far behind all you Uber elder farmers...

However, last night I hit a new milestone! I cleared Uber lab. It’s the first time ive ever gotten a shot at that last ascendency node and cleared it on my first try.

Only my third league (started when it came to PS4 with Synthesis) so I’m still fairly new but am just having fun pushing on and finding better gear and inching towards the shaper and elder battles.

That 4th ascendancy was huge too! I feel so much tankier now.

There's nothing wrong with being slow. You need to have fun with the game -- that's what's most important! So the fact that you're clearing new end-game content and having fun is win-win. Grats man! But keep grinding away. There's plenty of time still in the league to clear most of the atlas and work your way up to Shaper and beyond :)

but removing wand means loosing 1 spectre I know damage is already more than enough but don't know about losing 1 spectre :(

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Undicesimo написал:

but removing wand means loosing 1 spectre I know damage is already more than enough but don't know about losing 1 spectre :(

Ah, I didn't think that it made your Spectre gem level 31 giving you a 6th spectre. What's your current dps in PoB? I'm assuming it's ridiculously high, and with a 6th spectre, that you're somewhere around 10-12m dps? So stuff just gets deleted anyway, so do you really need to be tankier?

What's the main reason(s) for you wanting to be tankier?