Ziz interview

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creeten#4303 написал:

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Marinxar#3048 написал:

Awesome interview, and it highlighted the problem.

Jonathan.

Jonathan should just get benched with Chris. let them handle the business aspects, and let Mark take over lead of the design of the game. Just like Chris, Jonathan suffers from a severe case of tunnel vision. If something works for him, he can't wrap his head around the fact that most people don't also like that same thing. It's beyond his comprehension.

To save the franchise, and the growth and success of both games, you need people with a broader scope of mind to lead the design.

Mark was literally sitting there telling Jonathan to just shut up and stop talking, but Jonathan just kept digging deeper and deeper. Clinging to the same failed vision as if it was the only option.

I don't think his "Vision" (God, I hate to use that word now) is failed at all.
Ofc the patch was a bit scuffed, especially in the early game, but the general concept works very good. As it did in 0.1.

And there are a LOT of people really liking the way they want to design the game. Me included.

Just because a few salty PoE 1 veterans are really loud on social media does not mean that no one is liking the core design of the game.

Just go to the Steam game page. And the steam is mostly new to the game, not veterans.

Maybe you like this kind of thing, and there are dozens of masochists in the world, but the facts and reviews say otherwise. About 10,000 people leave the game every day. And this is only in the Steam

For example, take the release schedule, where 12% of people stopped playing the game in a week. And the last week, during which 20% of people left the game. And not just those interested in the new release left, but those who already knew about the game and played it while waiting for the new patch. People were disappointed with the patch, and the very negative reviews about the game over the past week speak directly about this.

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Soulscar1#4896 написал:

I am not a big fan of Zizaran but the interview changed my mind about him somewhat.

Johnathon - We didn't change the campaign difficulty.... Ok mate what does nerfing all builds by 90% across all levels and increasing monster health and damage do Einstein? Doesn't make the campaign easier does it mate? I lost all hope this guy lives on PLANET EARTH the moment that came from his pus.

Everyone will discuss our game in terms of variation, but we will remove 50% of the gems from the tree, weaken all the characters (including new ones) and arrange the talents so that you will have exactly one possible character creation option and maybe 3-4 subclasses to implement them.

During the interview I became more and more annoyed by Ziz, seemed to me that all he wants from the game is to breeze through it without any challenge and get constant dopamin spikes from shiny drops.

My biggest fear for the future of POE2 is that it gets dumbed down to D4 levels where someone can play it with eyes closed and hands behind the back. I am not saying it's in the right place now, especially when it comes to average builds but it's only 0.2, I have faith they will make it right before final release, at least if they stay true to their "vision" (there, I said it).

Personally I wish for a campaign skip of some sorts for twinks/leage restarts, which sadly wasn't even mentioned during the interview despite some lengthy discussions about the campaign itself.

One thing Jonathan seemed to miss though, and I wished Ziz would've pointed that out, is why vendoring/gambling is more lucrative right now, at least during the campaign. A regal only gives you one stat more, you are still missing 3 stats. When I sell 10 golds and try my luck at the vendor, I feel like I'm getting a much higher chance to get an item with all 6 stats. It would be a different story if exalts would drop more often but sadly they don't.

And after campaign your best use for exalts is trading, neither regals nor vendors come even close.

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creeten#4303 написал:

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Marinxar#3048 написал:

This is the reality. In the 10+ years I been playing PoE, there has never been such a negative response to any update.

So you guys cupping Jonathan's balls, telling him everything is fine, and go with the plan, are actually doing irreparable damage to the game and the future of the franchise.

At best, its doing irreparable damage to you and other people disliking the general core design of PoE 2.
And you know, its pretty much impossible to make a game that everybody loves. So some people will be mad anyways.

Player counts at 0.1 release and even now are looking very solid though, so either all you guys that hate the game play it anyways, or there actually is a large playerbase that loves the concept of the game.

I've not played PoE 1 that extensively, so I don't have as much anecdotal evidence of shitstorms in the past. However, from what I have seen at 0.1 launch and now, I almost can't imagine that there hasn't been a negative response of that scale.

The PoE 1 community is truly toxic to its core, I've never been part of such a toxic community so far.

From what I've heard the devs even stopped interacting with reddit (And the community as a whole) because of personal attacks and death threats etc. in the past.

Over the past week, 20% of the players have left the game. There are strong suspicions that players fall off as they progress through the acts and their patience. That is, the game acts are unreasonably prolonged and the players simply stop playing when they reach the "X" point. But since the game is delayed, this process is a bit time-consuming. To be honest, I expected a 50% drop online. But at the start, I underestimated the length and difficulty for an ordinary player. Apparently, some people just haven't reached their X-point yet

I feel like I finally know what the vision is. It's just Jonathan's unhinged definition of fun, challenge for the sake of challenge.

He genuinely doesn't want to reward the players with gear or power because that might lower the challenge, no meaningful defenses because challenge. a rogue lite mini game with all negative upgrades can only be the work of someone truly unwell, spending his spare time poking himself with a soldering iron looking for the most satisfying spot.

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Seymour91#3032 написал:

It’s honestly really sad to see posts like this. I’m not a big fan of the recent update myself, and I have quite a few concerns with PoE 2 in general.

That said, it’s clear that a lot of people are loving the game.

Jonathan might have come across a bit grumpy at the start of the interview, but as it went on, he opened up more. People seem to forget the kind of pressure he must be under. You can tell he’s poured his soul into this project, and facing constant negativity when you've invested so much of yourself in something has to be incredibly tough. I think he handled it with a lot of composure.

As someone who works as a lead dev/tech lead/architect in IT, I can’t count the number of times I’ve been in a situation where I knew my solution was better, but the business side didn’t agree—simply because they didn’t see the full picture. More often than not, time proves me right.

As a player, your perspective is valid, but it’s also very different from Jonathan’s. You might be right about some things—but probably wrong about a lot more. He’s been doing this for many years. If you truly believe you have that level of vision and design talent, build your own game—and see how you handle the pressure.

Perhaps, in order not to get into such a situation, it is sometimes worth paying attention to the "vision" of ordinary players and putting your personal in a dark corner for a while? I'm not saying that I don't like everything about the new patch, but a more detailed analysis of the patch, interviews, and their changes right before the patch suggests that they don't understand a thing about their own game. And when you're already confused yourself, you don't have enough time to accurately realize your "vision" - it's worth asking for help. It was enough to ask the opinion of top build creators about their changes before making such edits that kill not only interest in the game due to excessive complexity. But they also kill the main idea of the game - you can take a magician and be a warrior. Now the game has literally been reduced to 3-4 working builds. You can't add any creativity in building your build, because even the most meter-high builds hardly allow you to play fully.

zizaran fans follow what zizaran does, he has a hell of a lot of influence over how they see the game

so when he says "most people experience X,Y,Z" he means he experiences it and therefore his stream chat subscribers do too

He is a tunnel visioned player and he does not speak for everyone

I'm finding the campaign much easier than 0.1, not faster, but easier. I've not had to do any trade (act 5 so far) whereas I did in 0.1. Some of that comes from familiarity but it also comes from higher number of rares dropping and the QoL improvements that were already in place by the end of 0.1 and introduced at the start of 0.2

I understand the response to seeing Jonathan is the issue, if you only watched the first 10 minutes. I thought he handled each question well after that, was thoughtful and seemed very genuine while trying to understand each issue while elaborating his view. In the beginning he did feel very uptight and even combative... probably because of insane backlash this patch has received and the overreaction to it.

I really appreciated Jonathan’s approach to gaming. I am completely with him when he states that the game should have challenge to it! AT LAST, NO MORE WALKING SIMULATOR 2025!!! The loud minority of ARPG players will need to “git good scrub” and stop with afk-like builds they download from sites. Now ARPGs can be taxing and fun for all but the stereotypical brain dead ARPG player. 🥰🥳👍

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Marinxar#3048 написал:

This is the reality. In the 10+ years I been playing PoE, there has never been such a negative response to any update.

So you guys cupping Jonathan's balls, telling him everything is fine, and go with the plan, are actually doing irreparable damage to the game and the future of the franchise.

I remember 3.15 was very unpopular, it was a nerf league and I remember Chris going on multiple casts doing damage control and saying there wouldn't be more nerfs like this.