Make playing the game the best way to advance

"

FipsDieGrille#2655 написал:

There are so many wrong assumptions in this thread, i hardly know where to begin with :D

1.) More divine drops to comfort people that have less time
- Would not change anything because if the drop rate is higher, it just means everyone gets more so the prices will increase in the same rate. All you would get is that you can use a divine orb more often to craft yourself but i doubt that is what you want

2.) changes to drop rates in SSF does not affect anyone else.
- I already said that this would require first to change that you can integrate your SSF characters into the trade league. So this is what you would need to adress in your feedback first.

3.) Some drops are insanely rare like hinekoras lock or a mirror
- This is a good design. Both items are absolutely not necessary to have a good time in the game or get good gear. But it creates chances for people to have an insane drop and a great moment. It functions like lottery. I never found one of those too btw. And most people also will never find a mirror in their life, which is fine.

4.) The problem with your argument that you just describe the way you want to play is that you still insist on: it doesnt affect others but of course it does.
Even if we say they change SSF to be an absolute independent league and therefore allows them to tweak drop rates, there will be a lot of people who do not want your changes because the game is already quite easy and if you do it, for many people it becomes just trivial. Your argument is flawed because you cant see the other side. I do understand your position but i am telling you, once you really get into the game, you would understand that it is actually quite easy even with the drop rate as it is, and also in SSF. But i notice that you do not want to accept that although a lot of people show you that it is easily done.

+1

"

Lymez#5507 написал:

"

Hellbringer#3048 написал:

Your whole point is that "i'm doing it wrong". My whole point, is that the way that I want to play is not dependent on your opinion. Getting drops is random. My "skill" is fine. My game knowledge might be better if I spent more time looking up stuff instead of playing the game, sure. Again, not how I enjoy "playing" games. I like to actually play them instead of researching arcane subsystems and getting my PoE PhD. Call me old fashioned. I've got 222h in since 10/24. Found 2 Div running t14/15 maps with 6 mods (actually divs were found leveling, not in maps). 222h/6 weeks tomorrow is 37h/wk, playing this game. 0 sellable items, nothing better than what i got donated when i first hit maps.

did you actually get 2 div in 222h played? did i understand that correctly?

Yes, not counting the ones that people gave me... if i count those i have 17

Also at least half that game time was running t14/15 maps with rarity. I cant tell from your post if that is normal but I believe you think that's low. Correct me if I'm wrong. Maybe I just have the worst luck.

"

FipsDieGrille#2655 написал:

There are so many wrong assumptions in this thread, i hardly know where to begin with :D

1.) More divine drops to comfort people that have less time
- Would not change anything because if the drop rate is higher, it just means everyone gets more so the prices will increase in the same rate. All you would get is that you can use a divine orb more often to craft yourself but i doubt that is what you want

2.) changes to drop rates in SSF does not affect anyone else.
- I already said that this would require first to change that you can integrate your SSF characters into the trade league. So this is what you would need to adress in your feedback first.

3.) Some drops are insanely rare like hinekoras lock or a mirror
- This is a good design. Both items are absolutely not necessary to have a good time in the game or get good gear. But it creates chances for people to have an insane drop and a great moment. It functions like lottery. I never found one of those too btw. And most people also will never find a mirror in their life, which is fine.

4.) The problem with your argument that you just describe the way you want to play is that you still insist on: it doesnt affect others but of course it does.
Even if we say they change SSF to be an absolute independent league and therefore allows them to tweak drop rates, there will be a lot of people who do not want your changes because the game is already quite easy and if you do it, for many people it becomes just trivial. Your argument is flawed because you cant see the other side. I do understand your position but i am telling you, once you really get into the game, you would understand that it is actually quite easy even with the drop rate as it is, and also in SSF. But i notice that you do not want to accept that although a lot of people show you that it is easily done.

Divs are just a symptom of the problem I am using to illustrate it. I would be fine with crafting items being more common drops too, and using those to make gear. Divs are locked to tier, so if your tier rolled bad no div can fix it.

Is 222h not enough to get into the game? most people consider a "long" RPG to be 80-100h. In Diablo you'd have multiple characters pretty much maxxed in that playtime, save paragon levels.

To your points:
1+2. I already said put it in SSF, make a separate check box, make those characters permanently locked in SSF or make them poof at season end or whatever, easily fixed.

3. although those items are insanely rare, again it is more of a symptom of overall game design than those specific items. Ideally, useable, increasingly better gear would drop and then you could use mats to improve them, but the randomness built into much of the currency precludes that without omens and such. Chaos for instance removing random mods. Fine, if you have like 2 or 3 to pick from and hope to get lucky, not so fine if you have 5/6 good ones and want to fix the last. Plus i don't have enough chaos to spam those for very long either.

4. As i have said several times, improved drop rates can be a separate check box you select if you go into SSF, its own mode separate from even normal SSF, that doesn't interact with the game otherwise. Also you keep insisting it is super simple to do, while ignoring my personal experience of 2 whole divs... even if i was wanting to play the market, buy the mats or gear/craft whatever, how would that even be possible even if i had started with league start? Is 2d a ton, ever? Sure I have some omens that i might have been able to trade, but all the gear ive found/checked with the market isn't worth anything. It's because of a broken market that is disproportionate to the farming time it takes to achieve it because of bots and RMT.

I grouped with a guy the other night he took me through all 3 breach realmgate things and all 3 expedition ones? I think. Even there drops were pretty much the same and I could have never done that myself with my 16k dps.

"

Offfit#6199 написал:

"

ac429#4687 написал:

SSF should not have higher drop rates. The issue isn't that drop rates are bad, because that's just relative. The problem is that the best way to get gear in trade is to trade. SSF already fixes that.

Saying SSF should have higher drop rates is like saying there should be more ducks when you go for a walk in the park. No, you can already enjoy walking in the park. Ducks per hour is just a requirement that you made up in your head.

SSF in last epoch with special ssf guild is very good. It's like choice in fantasy quests: you either climb social ladder through merchants and other NPCs, or you go as hermit and learn basics by focusing on yourself.

I also really enjoy that system in LE, I suck at crafting in POE sadly (my irl responsibilities just don't allow for that dedication) and I really kind of dislike buying things from players although I do here and there.

The ability to focus a type of loot in LE and farm for stuff with a somewhat targeted focus/quest if you will, is very nice a "just right" feeling imo.

"

bloomhead#3858 написал:

"

Hellbringer#3048 написал:

"

The_Song#4903 написал:

1 drop total, and 100 drops where 99 are trash, are identical experiences.
There's no difference between a trash drop and no drop.
For all intents and purposes, a drop that isn't worth picking up didn't drop.
So either way, still low drops.

Yep. I don't mind filtering through hundreds of trash drops... unless its always trash and never worth picking up. Again, if you calculate the odds based on the weights, by the time you get to a worthwhile item you want youre at millions of drops. Doesn't bode well if you'd like to just play the game and eventually get items.

Or decrease drops but make them targeted drops, there are lots of options to fix this issue and none of them require much more than tweaking some arbitrary numbers.

And yet again, the argument that wins all discussions: "there are lots of options to fix this issue and none of them require much more than tweaking some arbitrary numbers"

No it's not. You can't imagine how utterly complex such a system is.

So, only game devs understand coding? I aced organic chemistry, calculus, physics, have multiple degrees including in computer science medicine and run linux boxes and write (simple, mind you) scripts for fun. Somehow I think I have a pretty good grasp on what it looks like to code a game, and yes all of the drop values are variables on tables that could be copy pasted, then edited to produce the desired effect.

Just because YOU don't understand it, doesn't mean others cant. Game devs don't have a monopoly on IQ or reading comprehension.

"

ac429#4687 написал:

Ducks per hour is just a requirement that you made up in your head.

I love this.

"

jadenharrow#0988 написал:

"

Offfit#6199 написал:

"

ac429#4687 написал:

SSF should not have higher drop rates. The issue isn't that drop rates are bad, because that's just relative. The problem is that the best way to get gear in trade is to trade. SSF already fixes that.

Saying SSF should have higher drop rates is like saying there should be more ducks when you go for a walk in the park. No, you can already enjoy walking in the park. Ducks per hour is just a requirement that you made up in your head.

SSF in last epoch with special ssf guild is very good. It's like choice in fantasy quests: you either climb social ladder through merchants and other NPCs, or you go as hermit and learn basics by focusing on yourself.

I also really enjoy that system in LE, I suck at crafting in POE sadly (my irl responsibilities just don't allow for that dedication) and I really kind of dislike buying things from players although I do here and there.

The ability to focus a type of loot in LE and farm for stuff with a somewhat targeted focus/quest if you will, is very nice a "just right" feeling imo.

I honestly wouldn't mind being "forced" to craft gear and learn the systems, but the typical good/great/GG items you see crafting tutorials for are buying mats with div and spending 10-40d in just mats. I found ONE orb of annul. Not going to be doing much crafting with that.

"

Hellbringer#3048 написал:

I just want to play the game and kill stuff and pick up good gear.

Tihs is a known problem that the leads have talked about in both the interview with ZiggyD and with Destin.

I don't agree with the solutions you propose in the OP. As an aside, Last Epoch is a terrible example: they are floundering financially, and their approach to SSF has been a failure so far. But GGG is trying to make drops matter more.

One way Jonathan phrased it is that players need to have a reason to pick up a Tier 5 drop, instead of just crafting from white bases.

"

Hellbringer#3048 написал:

I honestly wouldn't mind being "forced" to craft gear and learn the systems, but the typical good/great/GG items you see crafting tutorials for are buying mats with div and spending 10-40d in just mats. I found ONE orb of annul. Not going to be doing much crafting with that.

Same to be honest, and I just don't have IRL time watch many hours of youtube videos and then farm the currency to craft respectable items. I rather just play, kill things, farm, and see how far I get, guess I am a filthy casual

"

jadenharrow#0988 написал:

"

Hellbringer#3048 написал:

I honestly wouldn't mind being "forced" to craft gear and learn the systems, but the typical good/great/GG items you see crafting tutorials for are buying mats with div and spending 10-40d in just mats. I found ONE orb of annul. Not going to be doing much crafting with that.

Same to be honest, and I just don't have IRL time watch many hours of youtube videos and then farm the currency to craft respectable items. I rather just play and see how far I get, guess I am a filthy casual

I don't know the best way to craft in SSF 0.4, but in 0.3 a good strategy was: fracturing orbs and recombinator. You don't need all the fancy omens. Just pick up a lot of mid items, run Expedition to fuel the recombinator, and run cleansed maps for the fracturing orbs.