Why I've given up hope of this game becoming great (but not quite on GGG)

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kasub написал:

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And did you say Buzzsaw does negligible damage? That's hilarious.

I think I know that better than anyone else :) I have a fully geared buzzsaw character and when I group with SA characters I play pure support(equip romira/take conduit/stick to them while using vaal gems). DPS is ok but is negligible compared to that build.

I have 16.5k DPS which is way above most buzzsaw characters.

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Then you should know that 16.5k sheet DPS isn't actually 16.5k DPS; A SA build might be able to hit the DPS of a Ele Buzz build with a strong Harbinger bow, but you're still gonna have problems in alot of other departments.


I didn't even mention what happens if you don't run the standard RT Ele Buzz build and actually have the gear to pull off a Crit ST build.

Obviously?.. I'm talking about actual clearspeed here. 2nd atziri boss takes me 3 mins at my quickest yet it takes a physical crit build all of 20 seconds.

Shrine piety might take me only 20 seconds but that SA build one hits her with puncture.

I'm really not going over every specific here. Yes each build has advantages and such not to mention buzzsaw has way better resists/cost effectiveness. The point is to demonstrate to you the basis of manaleech being more than viable with many builds. You exaggerated the need for BM/EB, I disagreed with that. We've gotten a bit off point though.

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I didn't even mention what happens if you don't run the standard RT Ele Buzz build and actually have the gear to pull off a Crit ST build.

At my elemental buzzsaw gear level, a life crit ST build is not better at all. I tried this so I know. Of course you can get ridiculous daggers that far surpass bino to get higher DPS but everything else is still worse(reflect, survivability, mobility, max res and especially your ability to do map mods).

^can't you two make a new thread discussing builds vs one another? Just saying...

@scrotie

ill give you a +1, but not for you, but for every other thread saying exactly the same thing you said that got burned to a crisp.

peace,

-Boem-

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Splift написал:

I have never felt that twitch aspects in poe don't work because of desync. If I get hit by a vaal smash or dominus's fist of god, its my fault, not some game flaw. Sure desync can throw a wrench in things at times, but I feel it is heavily exaggerated unless everyone complaining about it is running cyclone with multistrike etc.

I feel the average person exaggerates this as well. To make things perfectly clear, I have a barely broadband internet connection myself (2 Mbps) and I would estimate I encountered truly desync about once per 4 hours of playtime. However, I live in Texas, rather close geographically to the US server (Houston, IIRC), so I estimate my speeds on, say, the East coast would be unacceptable; additionally, I avoid desync-heavy skills like Cyclone like the plague.

My point is not that desync is rampant; my point, made in the first post, is that with a game of this design, desync once every four hours is just as unacceptable as a complete client crash once every four hours, and having certain skills being significantly more susceptible to desync in a game of this design means those skills may as well not exist at all, because they're not truly viable. It is PoE's core combat design which makes desync so important — it has less to do with the frequency of desync so much as an ability to truly trust the client to provide accurate information.

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Splift написал:

Its funny to see people who have spent hundreds or several thousands of hours in a game inevitably get bored then turn around and call said game the trash of the land when that happens and claim that the makers who gave them said game nearly for free with no strings attached, are devils.

I agree with this. GGG's original vision for Path of Exile was a game you could play for hundreds of hours and not get bored with. It was a very ambitious vision, but it was one I shared, and thus I actually am disappointed that I've become bored with it. Perhaps I shouldn't be disappointed, because I shouldn't have had such unrealistic expectations. Still, it was free(ish), and I feel I made a specific point of not calling the GGG team devils. If anything, I'm looking forward to future games from them. But that's the thing which made me write this post — the introspective realization that I'm expecting great things from GGG's future games, and no longer from PoE itself.

Still, this is a very good point to make: GGG aren't bad people, they're merely fallible people, and criticism should be constructive. Disappointment I can understand, but to actually be angry at the devs about the game in general is borderline insanity. (The only thing GGG did which ever made me actually angry was changing the spelling of Fidelitas to match an incorrectly pronounced voiceover; they've since fixed this.)

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JahIthBer89 написал:

What bugs me about this post is that you're assuming everyone expects twitch-reflexes to be the foundation of what makes an ARPG great. Even though this is, historically, the furthest thing from the truth.

There are plenty of games out there whose sole purpose is to test your twitch reflexes, and not a single one of them is an ARPG.

I will concede that players play APRGs for different reasons, to include the farmer. To take the concept beyond just ARPGs and to include any genre with a real-time combat system, a farmer is someone who prefers content which doesn't require any form of twitch skills whatsoever in order to defeat, usually by choosing a playstyle/build which bypasses the need for such reflexes; for example, farmers in first-person-shooters tend to favor whatever stealth and/or sniper mechanics the game possesses, as they can often find spots where they can remain safe perpetually, take a sip from a drink, then eventually perform a kill, with as little "actual combat" as possible. For clarification, I'm not saying farmers are full-on casuals, only that they are casual in one aspect of the game (twitch challenges aka mousework); they still can be, and often are, very hardcore in other aspects of play.

I'm definitely not saying an ARPG should be devoid of farming opportunities. However, one thing — actually, two separate things — which a good first-person-shooter normally does well is that it ensures that farmers feel clever when they find farming opportunities. This is two things because opportunity means the feasibility of farming is not always equally present at all locations, and that you need to think strategically and utilize your environment in order to pull it off (while not requiring any fast mousework). If you fail to see these opportunities and appropriately capitalize on them, the game's response is to shove you back into twitch-challenge land once again.

Thus, I believe it's only safe to say that the default playstyle in an ARPG should be the twitch challenges I described earlier, and thus all the importance ascribed to desync in my original post is still valid. Farming should be viewed as a secondary playstyle; I imagine it's possible to have an ARPG where farming is viewed as the primary, rather than secondary, playstyle, but I believe it's false advertising to label such an ARPG as "hardcore."

^ I will add in ScrotieMcB what I experienced from living on the east coast in an area where the choices (while not stellar) aren't that bad. I get a range of 50-100 ms ping depending on the day, my jitter is around the 15ms range, I get 0 dropped packets, my DL speed is around 8mb/sec, my upload around 700kb/sec and this in on DSL. There are two providers with the other being cable and giving about the same performance level for the same cost. My system runs the game well above 100fps in most areas, and unless I'm intentionally trying to break the engine can go down to around 60fps in the more unoptimized areas of the game.


There is never a moment where I am actually close to being in sync. Everything is constantly teleporting around, I desync through walls that have no doors anywhere remotely close to me, fighting near rocks/doorways/etc is hell being that nothing is sync'd EVER, avian retches don't walk as they constantly teleport and the known desync provoking skills are engine breaking for me completely.

At this point I just accepted it and build according to it... So that leaves pretty much summoners and ranged aoe as being the choices I have to make the game acceptably playable for me because otherwise the game falls completely out of sync all the time. While everything else I play, including FPS, work absolutely great even internationally.

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Jiero написал:

I get a range of 50-100 ms ping depending on the day, my jitter is around the 15ms, my DL speed around 8mb/sec, my upload around 700kb/sec and this in on DSL.

Ping is obviously the most relevant stat. Mine's normally 30-50 despite much slower up and down speeds. Location, location, location.

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Splift написал:

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Kranyum написал:

it's ironic to see how pretty much all the old supporters of the game such as Scrotie and Charan are expressing their dissapointment in the game. Because that's what the game currently is: a big dissapointment.

I would say its a success that they have kept such people interested for so long before they inevitably got bored.

Right vaal gems are stupid and pointless, lets just continue this meta where everyone uses one dps skill, one movement skill and one curse.

If Chris is rich from this its because they flat out deserved it. No other game has had less strings attached and less hooks in their "revenue stream".

Why would he listen to people talking with your tone? You come off as an arrogant, entitled brat and bending their knee to such people would surely bring about the games true demise.

lol brosky. Let's see your supporter titles? Don't got any? Then shut up.
I have supported about 400 dollars to this game, I am invested and I have the right to be emotional about it.
[removed by support]

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Kranyum написал:

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Splift написал:

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Kranyum написал:

it's ironic to see how pretty much all the old supporters of the game such as Scrotie and Charan are expressing their dissapointment in the game. Because that's what the game currently is: a big dissapointment.

I would say its a success that they have kept such people interested for so long before they inevitably got bored.

Right vaal gems are stupid and pointless, lets just continue this meta where everyone uses one dps skill, one movement skill and one curse.

If Chris is rich from this its because they flat out deserved it. No other game has had less strings attached and less hooks in their "revenue stream".

Why would he listen to people talking with your tone? You come off as an arrogant, entitled brat and bending their knee to such people would surely bring about the games true demise.

lol brosky. Let's see your supporter titles? Don't got any? Then shut up.
I have supported about 400 dollars to this game, I am invested and I have the right to be emotional about it.
[removed by support]

Hmm I've spent more than you. So I guess I have the right to tell you to shut up too?

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Telzen написал:

Hmm I've spent more than you. So I guess I have the right to tell you to shut up too?

you actually don't.
0 dollar invested white knight forum trolls who come here after 3 weeks of playing telling people that have actually supported this game that it should be this and that, is one thing...

comparing money invested when the sums are both in the hundreds of dollars (more than any game title really) is another.

fact of the matter is, I have invested money in this game and I am dissapointed that I have. I could have invested more into Dota 2 a game that I probably played a lot more than PoE and which I still enjoy after 3+ years (so yes it is possible to make a game last - just listen to your community and deliver a polished experience...)

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ScrotieMcB написал:

I feel the average person exaggerates this as well. To make things perfectly clear, I have a barely broadband internet connection myself (2 Mbps) and I would estimate I encountered truly desync about once per 4 hours of playtime.

I have 24 mgbps net and i encounter desync in 1 out of 3 attacks.Feel free to check my videos,even though i am trying to upload the ones with "less" desync :P.BTW nice post,totally agree.
When you have an RPG,you always have the character level,stats and gear that play a prety big role.Besides that,on clasic RPGs you also have to use your mind strategically,while on action RPGs you have to play well - as in an action game-concerning reflexes etc as you say.When the game design fundamendally prevents that-due to monster design and technical flaws-all you are left with are numbers on your character.