Pohx: POE is now like D3, leveling is too easy, map system the same, most uniques sucks....

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grepman написал:

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diablofdb написал:

The guy played 80+ hours week of POE and got bored of it, that's irrelevant.


I even sometime take some pause of POE and go play other games for a while, then come back to POE, and I don't even play POE that much.


That's just overplaying the game and yeah it's normal he got bored of it.

this is not remotely what hes talking about at all. he's comparing the game then and now. burning out has nothing to do with this.

Look I don't want to dish his opinion or even says he's wrong but...

him playing 80+ hour every week making a living out of playing POE for the past few years, vs me enjoying a 2-3 weeks to 1 month of gaming on POE then taking a break, then coming back for the next league. I think our experience of the game will be very different you know.

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Hilbert написал:

The reality is different. It's the sentiment of somebody growing tired.

no, you created your own argument and now are projecting it on someone who has diametrically opposite opinion, to push your agenda. not only that, you also speak for him, which is hilarious.


Pohx plays grinding games including 'Asiagrinder MMOPRGs'

the 'grindy' period you're referring to is when the game was actually challenging due to player power being held in iron fist in a velvet gloves by the devs and drops, including map drops not given out like candy

Ill argue perandus was the worst league because you just were given shit. Pohx echoes that sentiment (not the worst league, but the 'being given') in past state of exile and on stream.

Pohx isnt growing tired of the same thing you're saying. Not. Even. Close.

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diablofdb написал:

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grepman написал:

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diablofdb написал:

The guy played 80+ hours week of POE and got bored of it, that's irrelevant.


I even sometime take some pause of POE and go play other games for a while, then come back to POE, and I don't even play POE that much.


That's just overplaying the game and yeah it's normal he got bored of it.

this is not remotely what hes talking about at all. he's comparing the game then and now. burning out has nothing to do with this.

Look I don't want to dish his opinion or even says he's wrong but...

him playing 80+ hour every week making a living out of playing POE for the past few years, vs me enjoying a 2-3 weeks to 1 month of gaming on POE then taking a break, then coming back for the next league. I think our experience of the game will be very different you know.

what youre trying to do is sweep issues under the rug under 'he's just burned out' pretense. sorry, I dont buy it. He was burned out many times before, as do most streamers.

I'm guessing all the streamers talking about power creep and game becoming something else than it used to be, are just burned out. ok.

yeah well call it how you want, I know that if I was playing the same game for over 80hours per week I would go bored very quicky. I'm just amazed he played this game this long.

Give me a way to tune up the difficulty for better rewards, like:

5 settings of difficulty, each adding (makeshift numbers):
+10% quantity, +10% rarity, +30% monster life, +10% monster speed, +5% monster damage, +5% monster damage reduction, +1 monster level

So that i can tune up the difficulty of the game as my character progresses and not faceroll 95% of the content only to get killed by the 5% of the game which is usually spike damage.

Players get incentives to push their builds so they can do harder and harder content, and get rewarded by better rewards and experience.
Builds that can survive by smart play/build rather than 1 shotting the screen start to shine because monster life / damage reduction is high enough that they can't be 1 shot anymore.

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grepman написал:

no game 'needs' both groups. the money excuse is exactly what it is - an excuse. the money excuse is made by companies selling out and catering to lowest common denominators.

there are plenty of niche games that don't sell out. they maintain steady small core fanbases and are loyal to them.

poe was marketed and sold as a 'hardcore arpg youve been waiting for'. it was that game in the beginning. it is not anymore as player power was just handed out like candy

and poe was a huge success as that game. the 'making money' argument is the argument any company that sells out employs.

GGG is a business, their goal is to make money, so they can pay employees, pay rent, pay for servers etc. When your employer (if you have one) cuts your pay in half I believe you won't be disappointed, cause it's all just a "money excuse", working for idea is what's important.

Also PoE was never "sold". It's a F2P game, hence it makes sense for GGG to focus mostly on the largest group of players, and I doubt that group is "10 hours a day" one. It's actually impressive that this game can still appeal to both groups in some capacity.

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niche games are balanced around niche players. you probably heard of a game called EVE ? do you think EVE would ever dumb down and made itself accessible to casual players without time investment ?

compared to EVE tho, PoE is all about time investment because it has no skill involved.

EVE is a subscription based game, major part of which is a social element, you might say it's the one of the few "true MMOs" out there. PoE is a F2P game, primarily single player. There's a huge difference.

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ah the knowledge argument

there's nothing about knowledge that we didn't know three years ago. we knew whirling blades was a god movement skill but there was desync that prevented the 'go go' mode. we knew more multipliers were very powerful, but those didnt grow on trees

todays power creep isnt because some newfound knowledge of the game. its the array of tools and pure power, especially raw damage just given to players compared to before.

there's no 'knowledge' about using whirling blades. there's no 'knowledge' about putting on a tabula, 3-4 more multipliers/aoe, active spell and penetration and one-shot anything including most map bosses up till red maps. there's no 'knowledge' about ascendancy

maybe there's knowledge about slapping on a voidheart ? well ?

kripp, one of the most knowledgeable poe players at the time, died to merc kole twice in like a week back in 2013. kole can be one shot easily with like a 3 or 4 link spell right now.

people didnt stop and farm at certain points of leveling because they lacked knowledge. the leveling process wasnt harder because of lack of knowledge. it was because player wasnt given as powerful tools

Who's "we"? The game is still quite challenging for new players, as evidenced by Gameplay Help posts pretty much every day. You seem to have the same problem as Phox, namely, you played this game too much.

As for one shotting Kole with a 3-4 link spell, man, I'd like to see a video of that one. "Easily" as well, holy hell. (except for Flameblast, maybe)

Gear aquisition was harder three years ago, that's true. Was repeatedly farming docks or ledge, or doing Piety runs ad nauseum that fun though?

I think the game has got too easy, for sure. Maybe red maps are about right but up to there its too faceroll.

Toxic community? I dunno, I think humans can be pretty toxic all over the world, I feel like you just have to filter ppl out of your awareness. Hard as a streamer, I dont even read reddit, this place is toxic enough without going there, he gets that coming into his chat... I dunno, I think ziggy has the right attitude to it. Im a bit more trigger happy like pohx and zeno, but you got to do what you got to do at some point, just ban people instantly and dont let it touch you emotionally.

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PaperRat написал:

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grepman написал:

no game 'needs' both groups. the money excuse is exactly what it is - an excuse. the money excuse is made by companies selling out and catering to lowest common denominators.

there are plenty of niche games that don't sell out. they maintain steady small core fanbases and are loyal to them.

poe was marketed and sold as a 'hardcore arpg youve been waiting for'. it was that game in the beginning. it is not anymore as player power was just handed out like candy

and poe was a huge success as that game. the 'making money' argument is the argument any company that sells out employs.

GGG is a business, their goal is to make money, so they can pay employees, pay rent, pay for servers etc. When your employer (if you have one) cuts your pay in half I believe you won't be disappointed, cause it's all just a "money excuse", working for idea is what's important.

so if money is very important, why not make the game accessible and casual at the get go ? they would clearly maximize their profits that way, wouldnt they ?

why do companies make niche games at all then ? isnt it easier to cater to widest audience possible, ie lowest common denominator ?

why market a game for hardcore audience, advertise it as such, and then switch later ?
there's a term for this, it's called 'bait and switch'. granted, GGG havent completely done that at the beginning and Ive enjoyed a couple of years or so of the game they promised at the get go. still, its a spit in the face of the smaller, core fanbase who picked this game up to be one thing and now its another thing.

again, you're using every excuse in the book of 'selling out 101'.

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Also PoE was never "sold". It's a F2P game, hence it makes sense for GGG to focus mostly on the largest group of players, and I doubt that group is "10 hours a day" one. It's actually impressive that this game can still appeal to both groups in some capacity.

oh ok, so WHY DIDNT THEY FOCUS ON THE LARGE GROUP RIGHT AWAY ? answer, please. it's not like they went bankrupt with their original vision- on the contrary, theyve expanded and were doing quite well off in 2013 and 2014

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EVE is a subscription based game, major part of which is a social element, you might say it's the one of the few "true MMOs" out there. PoE is a F2P game, primarily single player. There's a huge difference.

Eve isnt the only niche game out there. There are plenty of niche games out there that refuse to dumb down to double dollars and go with their original vision.
Also, PoE was marketed not as a single player game, but rather a mmorpg-ish game.

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Who's "we"?

fine, I.

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The game is still quite challenging for new players, as evidenced by Gameplay Help posts pretty much every day. You seem to have the same problem as Phox, namely, you played this game too much.

um no. poe still has complexity. a game like that HAS to be challenging at first when you're learning ropes. after a week of play though, especially if you played ARPGs before, leveling is too easy and far more forgiving that it used to be

I played the game a ton in 2013 and never felt like I wasnt being challenged.
here you ago again tho, I've given you an undeniable list of factual tools being GIVEN to the player that greatly enhanced player power, tools that wouldnt make the damn game in the open beta because of how powerful they are, and yet you reply with some intangible, abstract 'you just played too much'...

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As for one shotting Kole with a 3-4 link spell, man, I'd like to see a video of that one. "Easily" as well, holy hell. (except for Flameblast, maybe)

you dont think a bladefall miner can one-shoot kole with a 4L ?
lol, a glove enchant and a totem can nearly one-shoot kole

definitely can near-one shot hillock
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEz30ErIJac

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Gear aquisition was harder three years ago, that's true. Was repeatedly farming docks or ledge, or doing Piety runs ad nauseum that fun though?

goalposts movement alert !
the discussion is about the difference in the game. you may consider something fun that I dont and vice versa. this isnt about that

As game gets more casual it's easier to get better gear or get to end game content. More ppl have fun cause most ppl are casuals, this is good. The "hardcore" gamers are the minority. Not everyone is fat or antisocial or both and plays video games 8 hours a day.

Excuse me? Pohx? Dude who always played clear-speed-meta sanic-gotta-go-fast builds, and pushed that meta further?

EXCUSE ME?!

Gotta admit I it is good giggle to see people lose their shit over Essence league, where it is obvious it is gonna be Talisman 2.0 level of useless. Lol.