Is DESYNC - really - that much of a problem? Really?

OP, do you play maps? Because while facerolling Docks or Lunaris 3 desync is hardly an issue. In maps the problem gets multiplied a few times.

Take some fast enemies, some added dmg say cold, which chills/freezes you (piling positional errors over time, the same as stun). Add mob movement & attack mod, which is a real multiplier for desync, and mix everything together in a cluttered map with narrow passages and difficult pathfinding.

Maybe add some shocking ground, which now means that being desynced just a little is a matter of life or death (it seems you are clear, but on the server you are actually standing on shocking ground and taking more damage). Shocking & burning ground also cause FPS drops on some machines, which adds to overall bad player response to the fast paced fighting.

Desync is a big issue, yes. And its the reason why the gameplay will never be skill based, because for that you need to know the real positions of enemies. Yeah, you can try to avoid blows and run behind cover, but the more you speed around enemies and clutter, the more desync you create. So, the possibility of reactive gameplay kinda defeats itself...
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"
morbo написал:
OP, do you play maps? Because while facerolling Docks or Lunaris 3 desync is hardly an issue. In maps the problem gets multiplied a few times.

Take some fast enemies, some added dmg say cold, which chills/freezes you (piling positional errors over time, the same as stun). Add mob movement & attack mod, which is a real multiplier for desync, and mix everything together in a cluttered map with narrow passages and difficult pathfinding.

Maybe add some shocking ground, which now means that being desynced just a little is a matter of life or death (it seems you are clear, but on the server you are actually standing on shocking ground and taking more damage). Shocking & burning ground also cause FPS drops on some machines, which adds to overall bad player response to the fast paced fighting.

Desync is a big issue, yes. And its the reason why the gameplay will never be skill based, because for that you need to know the real positions of enemies. Yeah, you can try to avoid blows and run behind cover, but the more you speed around enemies and clutter, the more desync you create. So, the possibility of reactive gameplay kinda defeats itself...


Doesn't [insert elemental effect] ground show a status on your computer even if you aren't standing on it client-side, like mine placement or trap start location always being where the server thinks you are? I've always felt that way in races but never tested it thoroughly.
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Последняя редакция: TheTenthDoc#6709. Время: 21 дек. 2013 г., 12:53:45
Play cyclone with mulistrike + faster attacks, and you will see the problem.
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TheTenthDoc написал:
Doesn't [insert elemental effect] ground show a status on your computer even if you aren't standing on it client-side, like mine placement or trap start location always being where the server thinks you are? I've always felt that way in races but never tested it thoroughly.


Yes it does. But gameplay is fast, visual clutter is everywhere and you are focused on the center of the screen. Even if you had time to look at icons, theres like 10+ of them all the time. With all the mess tht is going on, I have some times hard time to see my char, let alone if hes actually shocked or not.

Its one small thing that adds to desync caused difficulty.
When night falls
She cloaks the world
In impenetrable darkness
Последняя редакция: morbo#1824. Время: 21 дек. 2013 г., 13:06:13
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Pyrokar написал:



So the tl;dr of this thread reads: Desync isn't much of a problem because i like playing standard.

Great thread.


Why would thread aimed for non HC playes be a fail? Aren't we like .. what, 90% of all players? You guys knew what did you getting into, you knew the deal.


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Последняя редакция: Thorien_Kell#5909. Время: 21 дек. 2013 г., 13:13:09
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Shagsbeard написал:
What people don't notice is the good that is made possible because of the architecture used. We can react to stuff. We can use the geometry of the world. You can't do that in other games. You can't duck behind cover unless there's line of site and hit mechanisms that rely on position. Stuff like this is what makes PoE a lot more fun, but in turn desync is necessary to make it work that way.

They just complain without thinking about it.

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To OP, yes, it's an issue. I was just in a square room running along the borders kiting mobs when the desync magically teleported me to the center, where I died.

Normally you can deal with it, but when it does stuff like this it's maddening. And you can't play in hardcore because of it unless you play super conservatively. It just hampers playstyles.
Последняя редакция: Kieren_GGG#0000. Время: 21 дек. 2013 г., 13:23:09
I think desynch is the only reason why GGG try to have melee characters doing 10 times as much dps as range. For some, the carrot is worth the desync. For others like me, it will never be worth it.

In most games, I tend to prefer melee class because they can provide the mst dynamic and reactive gameplay. Ironically, because GGG wants a super fast action-packed gameplay with tons of mechanics melee is just not reliable, which leads to tanky builds with slow paced reactive gameplay.
I can imagine people arguing that "flicker strike is fast paced ! Cyclone can be fast paced ! Multistrike is fast paced !". You may think they are, because your character hits fast or teleport everywhere. But I don't consider them fast paced at all. You just click around and things explode around you. In fact, what's less reactive that a flicker strike build that strikes 10 times in a second ? This is not dynamic. At all. If you had a melee skill that needed a full 2 second of animation time to deal damage but dealt extreme damage, this would be 10 times better. But this wouldn't be manageable at all because of desynch.

Because of desynch, melee is buffed beyond what would be tolerated in other games. But very few complain, because this buff is the bandage put on top of the desynch.

My conclusion:
Desynch is no longer a problem in this game.
It's horrible, but those who suffer the most from it get a nice candy to ease the pain.

However, there should be a mesage in game every time you create a new character:
"If you want to play the game in a fair environment, play a ranged character. If you intend to play melee, remember that this world is an illusion, Exile".
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morbo написал:
OP, do you play maps? Because while facerolling Docks or Lunaris 3 desync is hardly an issue. In maps the problem gets multiplied a few times.


Ofc I do. Honestly I don't see that -drastic- difference.
Why difference exists on maps at all?


"

Desync is a big issue, yes. And its the reason why the gameplay will never be skill based, because for that you need to know the real positions of enemies.


As I've said, I don't consider it to be big issue, and i'm sure that I'm not the only one. Maybe I was lucky in combination of provider /connection /gateway distance etc, who knows.
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"
Thorien_Kell написал:
"
Pyrokar написал:



So the tl;dr of this thread reads: Desync isn't much of a problem because i like playing standard.

Great thread.


Why would thread aimed for non HC playes be a fail? Aren't we like .. what, 90% of all players? You guys knew what did you getting into, you knew the deal.




That's right. Screw those Hc guys. They are only a minority.

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Последняя редакция: Pyrokar#6587. Время: 21 дек. 2013 г., 13:21:55
I'm a witch fan, started as witch still a witch... never noticed major desynch
related deaths (ranged) but doing races I've played melee chars for fun
and desynch is pretty difficult to deal with, I have to learn the techniques
of engagement. my race deaths are half desynch and half my own mistakes,
but having gotten comfortable with range chars, I almost never die to it...
its almost always my mistakes. Hope there are good ways to adapt to mele desynch.

if not thats a bit of a tragedy.

such a hard problem to solve desynch from what I've read in other
informative posts. Chris has outlined why d3 is able to handle it better
by design (d3 simplified the gameplay somewhat, and cheated on animation
sequences to let gameplay flow better where GGG has not gone the same
route... there was a post in the dev manifesto a while back.)

if it was an easy or cheap fix, you know they would have done it.

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