That feel when the Chaos Recipe becomes a waste of time

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alg0801 написал:

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SilentStorm625 написал:

chaos recipe works even for experienced players. it is all about the time optimization workflow

Yet, the wealthiest players in the game are not doing chaos recipe.

where is the data? chaos recipe is a method everyone can embed in his gaming worflow. as a human you do X actions; you just embed chaos recipe pieces into the normal gaming workflow (super efficient, speedy, etc) and you are all set.

before you burn me as a witch, my job is in big data and analytics so I do this for a living.

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alg0801 написал:

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Peterlerock написал:

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leto2626 написал:

Personally I like arranging stashes etc, so the recipe is a nice side effect. I like picking stuff up, I don't like the clearspeed 'don't pick up anything anymore' meta.

I recently watched a streamer (I think it was "General Tso Chicken" or sth like that) blasting through something like his 90th to 100th shaped strand in a row that session, taking less than 1 minute each. Bamm! Next one! Bamm! Next one!
While some people find that amazing, to me it felt like the most terrifying thing I've ever seen. I don't want to play like this, this looked as tedious as assembly-line work.
Maybe I only get half as rich or half as many characterlevels/league, but if this is the prize?

One of my favorite maps is actually Waste Pool. A lot of dead ends and backtracking, but I like those little breaks into silence, when all you do is walk through these sewers.

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alg0801 написал:

However, this thread is about the Chaos recipe being a noob trap. It's unethical to continue to push noobs towards this action if you yourself know that it is a very inefficient way of generating currency.

Au contraire.

It's unethical to tell a player how he should play a game.
Let people find out for themself whether they want to use their tools or not.

False.

A Noob needs currency and asks both of us what to do.

You tell him Chaos recipe (full and well knowing that it is a poor choice for the goal)

I tell him that he should use a build that can clear quickly and only use the Chaos recipe until his build clears adequately fast at which point he should cut the chaos recipe out and focus on the numbers.

The facts and numbers are on my side. The numbers don't lie. Your advice is strictly based on your biased emotions and feelings towards the game. If Chaos recipe was the better option for generating currency, I would also be doing the Chaos recipe. General Tso would be doing Chaos recipe. Zizarian would be doing Chaos recipe. They're not.

If asked what is the best way to make Currency, both answers cannot be right. One of us must be wrong. Take your bias and false perception of the game out of it and look at the numbers.

Well they do spend tons of currency on chaosing each map and buying those sextants.. They never find enough sextants to maintain them.. They only probably get rich buy lucky drops that sell, mostly expensive uniques.. not currency drops. Sure they also sell maps.

I have roughly 6Ex and 900chaos and I still do it. But I only maintain 2 sets in the quad tab and if I get stuck needing one item I start IDing everything else or just not picking it up. That way I have a mix of playstyles which I believe gives more enjoyment per instance the either single method.

Quad Tabs, while on the subject.
TopRight two sets
Gloves, Head
Feet, Body
Ring, Ring
Amulet, Belt
2H Weapon
TopLeft - Maps
BottomLeft - quality gems
BottomRight - misc stuff I need to evaluate and dream up builds.

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SilentStorm625 написал:

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alg0801 написал:

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SilentStorm625 написал:

chaos recipe works even for experienced players. it is all about the time optimization workflow

Yet, the wealthiest players in the game are not doing chaos recipe.

where is the data? chaos recipe is a method everyone can embed in his gaming worflow. as a human you do X actions; you just embed chaos recipe pieces into the normal gaming workflow (super efficient, speedy, etc) and you are all set.

before you burn me as a witch, my job is in big data and analytics so I do this for a living.

Watch Lifting nerd's farm studies on 50/100 map runs. The total payout for 100 maps is pretty consistent across his studies. He even does the Chaos/regal recipe and records what he earns from that.

If you count the drops minus what he earns from chaos recipe, you can extrapolate roughly what he earns over 100 map runs by drop. He earns around 30c from the Chaos recipe per 100 maps.

Player A finishes a Strand map in 5min and does Chaos recipe.
Player B finishes a Strand map in 3min and does not do Chaos recipe. (this is still SLOW)

The further out you push this, the wider the wealth gap will become between Player A and Player B

In 5000 minutes Player A runs 1000 Strand maps.
In 5001 minutes Player B runs 1667 Strand maps.

This will result in Player B seeing 1.667x more currency drops but est -300c deficit from not doing Chaos recipe in the same time period.

Earlier ITT I did 3.5min vs 5min which resulted in a net gain of +532c for Player B based only on currency drops. This is not including things like Splinters or factoring in that Shaped Strand Maps sell for ~5c each. Also not factoring in that in a given period of time, Player B will be a higher level, more powerful, and deeper into the map pool/endgame which will open up larger opportunities for acquiring wealth.

i see where you are coming from. the problem with these studies is that ppl are not optimizing. I have tested it myself over the last 2 months as well. I do exactly the same trips with/or without the recipe, same mapping time, same rng pushing methodology, same trading, etc.

The trick is to replace the chaosrecipe actions with the ones from the non chaosrecipe workflow! And the downtime for trading to vendor do it at times when you cant do any mapping. This way you get passive income since a) you dont do anything differently and b) you get extra income when you dont map. It is a positive-sum game; doesnt matter if you are casual or pro

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SilentStorm625 написал:

i see where you are coming from. the problem with these studies is that ppl are not optimizing. I have tested it myself over the last 2 months as well. I do exactly the same trips with/or without the recipe, same mapping time, same rng pushing methodology, same trading, etc.

The trick is to replace the chaosrecipe actions with the ones from the non chaosrecipe workflow! And the downtime for trading to vendor do it at times when you cant do any mapping. This way you get passive income since a) you dont do anything differently and b) you get extra income when you dont map. It is a positive-sum game; doesnt matter if you are casual or pro

...it has to be genius who spends 2 mins per chaos recipe...

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SilentStorm625 написал:

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alg0801 написал:

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SilentStorm625 написал:

chaos recipe works even for experienced players. it is all about the time optimization workflow

Yet, the wealthiest players in the game are not doing chaos recipe.

where is the data? chaos recipe is a method everyone can embed in his gaming worflow. as a human you do X actions; you just embed chaos recipe pieces into the normal gaming workflow (super efficient, speedy, etc) and you are all set.

before you burn me as a witch, my job is in big data and analytics so I do this for a living.

Where is the data suggesting that wealthy players do not do the Chaos recipe? Ask them. None of the wealthy players I know, or the wealthy streamers we all watch do the Chaos recipe.

As has been said though, it all comes down to what you want to get out of the game. If you enjoy doing the recipe THEN DO IT!

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SilentStorm625 написал:

i see where you are coming from. the problem with these studies is that ppl are not optimizing. I have tested it myself over the last 2 months as well. I do exactly the same trips with/or without the recipe, same mapping time, same rng pushing methodology, same trading, etc.

The trick is to replace the chaosrecipe actions with the ones from the non chaosrecipe workflow! And the downtime for trading to vendor do it at times when you cant do any mapping. This way you get passive income since a) you dont do anything differently and b) you get extra income when you dont map. It is a positive-sum game; doesnt matter if you are casual or pro

It doesn't work this way in reality, which is why the most wealthy are not doing the Chaos recipe.

The act of doing the Chaos recipe naturally sends you to the vendor and stash more often. You end up picking up and identifying more items. You pause to review item drops to validate whether you need to pick something up or not. You pause to recall which pieces you need because filling up your inventory will slow you down further. Most of this is done without even realizing it. You back track for more minor items because in your mind...that chest piece is worth 2 chaos because it completes one of your sets.

You can see this occur with your XP/hr as well. Simply vendoring/stashing between maps can reduce your XP/hr by more than 50%, even with an efficient hideout layout. This is indicative of you "spinning the RNG wheel" half as much simply because you choose to vendor/stash.

okok I will show myself out. i found out a well planned way. just tried to see if you guys are interested so i can share a spreadsheet with you with timings and everything but cool. np, lets get back to mapping

no hard feelings. have fun folks

I do chaos recipe and make about 1-1.5k chaos per league doing so this is more then enough to finance anything i want combined whit league only unique drops which i sell.
The chaos recipe basicly lets me trade less, for me that is well worth the the time wasted on doing the recipe.
Also if nobody did the recipe cause it is not efficient there wouldnt be any chaos to trade whit.